Voice and Fist

Yesterday, I marched through Hollywood with my mom, her friend, and about 100,000 other people. We raised our fists and joined our voice to millions of other voices around the world. We sent a clear message to the Bush administration: This is just the beginning. We will stop your war machine. Your policies endanger America, and enrage the world.
I hope you are paying attention, Mr. Bush. The masses are speaking — the world is speaking — and we are rebuking you, your plutocracy, and everything you represent. Your time is over, Mr. Bush. The Supreme Court can not silence the voice of the world, as it silenced the voice of the American people. It is time for you to fade into history.
I hope that those who politically oppose Mr. Bush are also paying attention. There is a minority, on the cusp of becoming a majority, who are anxiously awaiting your leadership. Rise to the challenge, and give us representation in our government. Greens? Libertarians? Democrats? Who will represent the people? This is your moment. Do not squander it.
Peace.
UPDATE: Thank you, Senator Byrd.
UPDATE: I understand the visceral reactions that come when reading a post like this. If you’d like to comment or discuss, you are welcome to go to the Soapbox.

263 thoughts on “Voice and Fist”

  1. I’m glad you took part in protests, Wil. I get the feeling you would’ve been really ticked off at yourself if you’d not gone.
    As for war… it’s bullcrap. Everyone complains about the UN not working. Well, maybe we should try to help it work, fer feck’s sake.
    I dunno. It’s just a thought. Seems to me that the world is a little too big, and a little too small, to play America-the-Big-Lone-Cop anymore.

  2. IF Saddam ever actually used chemical weapons on his own people, well then, guess what:
    They’re the chemical weapons *we* gave him, back when he was Uncle Sams’s golden boy during the Iran/Iraq conflict.
    There’s no doubt that Saddam is a monster, but we’re the ones who made him. Something must be done about him, but I think this military action is ill advised.
    There are many people who say something should have been done about Saddam for years, so why are we now in such a rush to go to war? This administration has been in power for two years, and yet, nothing was mentioned about Saddam until recently. The cynic in me says it was just about the time that it became evident we’d never find Osama bin Laden…

  3. 6,000,000 people took place in marches around the world in various countries where the total populations added up to roughly 1,000,000,000.
    This means that 6/1000 or less than 1% of the people are definitely opposed to war. The rest either don’t care or support it.
    Remember Vietnam? A majority of American civilians were against it, but the government didn’t give a damn what they wanted. They left when they were defeated.
    Sorry to burst your bubble, but Bush doesn’t give a damn what such a small number of people want or don’t want.

  4. Very proud to hear that you joined the Peace demonstration. We had one in Toronto as well, and the accounts are that anywhere from 20,000 to 80,000 poeople (depending on who’s counting) came out to support peace. Montreal gathering was even more numerous – and there were so many more all over the world. The message is clear – it’s unfortunate that it will fall on deaf ears.

  5. Wil,
    if you are going to promote political subjects like this, don’t be surprised if you get flamed. Especially if you use such imflammatory methods as “voice and fist” and “your time is over”.
    Just remember the only reason (ONLY reason) that the democrats are anti-war right now is because no matter what happens, they end up looking good. If they support the President, they could lose.
    Btw, if it really was blood for oil, then why didn’t we keep kuwaite?

  6. Good job marching, Wil. However, here’s a question for you from an Iraqi exile that begs answering:
    I want to ask those who support the anti – “war” movement (apart from pacifists – that is a totally different situation) their motives and reasoning behind such support. You may feel that America is trying to blind you from seeing the truth about their real reasons for an invasion. I must argue that in fact, you are still blind to the bigger truths in Iraq. I must ask you to consider the following questions:
    Saddam has murdered more than a million Iraqis over the past 30 years, are you willing to allow him to kill another million Iraqis?
    Out of a population of 20 million, 4 million Iraqis have been forced to flee their country during Saddam’s reign. Are you willing to ignore the real and present danger that caused so many people to leave their homes and families?
    Saddam rules Iraq using fear – he regularly imprisons, executes and tortures the mass population for no reason whatsoever – this may be hard to believe and you may not even appreciate the extent of such barbaric acts, but believe me you will be hard pressed to find a family in Iraq who have not had a son/father/brother killed, imprisoned, tortured and/or “disappeared” due to Saddam’s regime. What has been stopping you from taking to the streets to protest against such blatant crimes against humanity in the past?
    Saddam gassed thousands of political prisoners in one of his campaigns to “cleanse” prisons – why are you not protesting against this barbaric act?
    An example of the dictator’s policy you are trying to save – Saddam has made a law to give excuse to any man to rape a female relative and then murder her in the name of adultery. Do you still want to march to keep him in power? . . . .
    Of course it would be ideal if an invasion could be undertaken, not by the Americans, but by, say, the Nelson Mandela International Peace Force. That’s not on offer. The Iraqi people cannot wait until such a force materialises; they have been forced to take what they’re given. That such a force does not exist – cannot exist – in today’s world is a failing of the very people who do not want America to invade Iraq, yet are willing to let thousands of Iraqis to die in order to gain the higher moral ground. Do not continue to punish the Iraqi people because you are “unhappy” with the amount of power the world is at fault for allowing America to wield. Do not use the Iraqi people as a pawn in your game for moral superiority – one loses that right when one allows a monster like Saddam to rule for 30 years without so much as protesting against his rule.
    In case you were wondering, it’s a rhetorical question.

  7. There was a small demonstration in Cincinnati too. About 300 people gathered on fountain Square in the downtown area. I was actually surprised to see that, since Cincinnati tries so hard to be the most conservative and tight-assed city in Ohio. Of course that’s just (Some of/most of)the city officials and not a majority of the residents…
    Anyone living in Washington D.C. should send Wil some pictures of that wonderful few feet of snow you have ;}

  8. I only hope we use nukes so that the war will be fast (I am sure we can still extract the oil). Also, I really hope it is televised. You scared little people. You’ll be lucky if we don’t line up you asses against a block wall and fire. Spineless little people. Long live George W. Bush, The President of The United States!

  9. It takes very little moral backbone to advocate for bunnies, flowers, sunshine and peace at all costs. It takes more backbone to advocate those decisions that are painful and difficult. If anyone has time, pull up the commentaries/opinion pages from the newspapers in the 1930′s in both the US and Britian. Nice to see that Neville Chamberlain is still alive in spirt these days. Do I want war? No. Do I advocate war? No. But, to quote Asimov, I never let my conscience satnd in the way of doing what is right.

  10. Why are you not asking Saddam to disarm and disclose where all the chemical and biological weapons are?
    Where are the protests to have him be as forthright as you are asking our government to be?
    I don’t know the answers, but all the people protesting seem to be ignoring this as well.
    Regards,
    Stuart

  11. Here, and a lot of places, I read comments similar to “the arabs all want to kill us!” and “the arabs would just as soon kill us as have a second cup of coffee” above.
    I have a friend (American) who lives in Iran. The most common question she gets (other than “Why aren’t you married?”)is “Why do Americans hate us?” The people wandering about the streets don’t want to fight with us, but they are afraid that we will invade them at any moment. If there is an anger growing there, it is an anger bred from living in fear of us.
    True, some of this IS cultivated by the government and media, but a lot of it comes from actions like those Bush has taken. Declaring Iran part of the “axis of evil” hurt Iranian citizens VERY deeply.

  12. PS- I really cannot believe you are throwing your lot in with Sen. Byrd. If there is a better example of a racist, back room dealing, pork barrel project, political opportunist scavenger then Byrd, I cannot think of one. Byrd is a political dinosaur in the shade of Helms and Wallace, in fact, Byrd is what is know as a “boll weavel” in political terms. You might want to try someone else that people might respect, like Danniel Innonwey (sp)

  13. “Btw, if it really was blood for oil, then why didn’t we keep kuwaite?”
    Ahh ….it’s Kuwait.
    As for the comment….Keep Kuwait(e)?!!!!! No….it’s someone elses country….you know…other people, like not American? Yes other people have countries as well.
    Ask yourself why would the US give a damn about a human-rights abusing non-democracy if it wasnt’t for their abundant oil? Get real, this war is only about one thing. Giving you cheap fuel so you can commute to work in a massive SUV.
    All those deaths will be your responsibility….you demand cheap oil, you pay for it with death.

  14. iraq does present a very real danger…but i don’t believe the case has been made yet to go to war…despite the attempt to whip up fear in the u.s. with the ridiculous multi-color alert system…but i do believe that the world community should keep the pressure on saddam hussein…and that includes being prepared to fight…but it doesn’t mean we have to force the timing of war without the support of those who would be most effected by any iraqi agression.

  15. Arron Gunn has said a mouthful. I hope all you monkeys are listening. You are mostly short sighted people with no concept of the grander scale. If you want America to leave the rest of the world alone you must be advocating more death and destruction like Sept 11. Leaving the vipers pit alone only allows the vipers to grow until they can’t be contained by the pit, and slither forth to spawn new pits in other areas. We are trying to wipe out the pit and save your sorry asses from a gassing. Just shut your cavernous skull caves while our armed forces put themselves in harms way to keep your ungrateful souls in Berkenstocks lined up at the nearest starbucks. Not wanting to see people killed is one thing. To allow others to be tourchered and killed because you don’t want us to do something about it is just plain sad. I really thought WWDN people were better than that.

  16. Let me preface this by saying that I love WWDN and I love Wil. I read this site religiously and love it more and more each time I do.
    Let me also say that I am in the U.S. Air Force, stationed in Germany. I’m proud of what I do and, right now, wouldn’t consider doing anything else.
    I read and listen to the anti-war protesters and I’m torn. On the one hand, I don’t like war. I don’t think anyone does. I’ve been deployed, I have friends who are deployed at this very moment, and I’ve helped carry many of the bodies of those troops you see on television returning home in flag-draped caskets. They are the sons, brothers, friends, and fathers of people that will feel their loss forever. When viewed from this perspective, I think it is safe to say that we are all anti-war.
    On the other hand, I do not wish to be reflexively anti-war. I would bet my next paycheck that there are a number of people in those teeming masses (latest polls indicate just UNDER 1/3 of the American population are opposed to war) that couldn’t even tell you why they are there. They simply get caught up in the anti-war (probably more correct to say anti-establishment) rhetoric and euphoria, repeat the catch phrases overheard from the protesters next to them, and march around with little idea as to why they are really there. They are just looking for an opportunity to scream at the government or those representing government (i.e. police, politicians, etc.) not to mention engage in public rioting. That, I feel, is equally wrong and idiotic.
    The questions that come to my mind when I see all of these protesters are:
    1. If not war, what is your suggestion? Many are those who shout out in defiance to our government, and that is their right. But, since you all seem to know what NOT TO DO, then I must also surmise that you know what the hell TO DO. What, pray tell, should we do?
    2. If you offer a suggestion and it does not work, what do we do then? We’ve been talking to and inspecting Saddam for over a decade. I’d say that course of action has been exhausted. What other suggestions do you offer?
    3. Do you disbelieve everything your government tells you? I understand mistrust of politicians, but even the worst liars tell the truth sometimes. Since the information has recently been declassified, I can tell you that I’ve seen the satellite photos of the Al Quada training camps in Iraq. I’ve sat in intelligence briefings and listened to Generals being briefed on how Iraq is helping fund known terrorists. And I did these things, not months, but YEARS ago. Now, do you still think your government is itching for a war?.
    4. The Iraqi people have been mistreated and murdered for years. Where were you then? The injustices of the Taliban government on women and the poor have been around for years. Where were you then? In recent years refugees have poured out of countries like Rawanda, Somolia, and several Western African countries in an effort to escape the tyrrany of thier government. Where were your voices then? If you’re going to shout for peace on the earth, then shout for peace on the WHOLE EARTH. If you truly feel this way, you’ll shout against conflict whereever it arises, not just when the potential for conflict comes to your door.
    As for me, although I’m torn, I’ll do what I swore to do; to support, and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; and bear true faith and allegiance to the same. I, and all others in the profession of arms, do this so people can march and protest and call me a baby killer in true neo-hippie fashion, I do this so children in Iraq can one day grow up in a free society, I do this for my family, I do this for you.
    Our country, in her intercourse with other nations may she be always in the right. But our country, right or wrong.
    Brock

  17. I support disarmament. I do not support all-out war. I do not think that all-out war is going to happen unless Saddam Hussein does what he was supposed to have been doing all along – DISARM and COME CLEAN.
    Why is the onus on us? The onus should be on HIM.
    I’m tired of this crap. The world should hold him accountable to the contract he signed.
    This however, is a difference of opinion and is polarizing office spaces and web communities everywhere :-)
    What I object to in your comments though Wil, is your thanking Senator Byrd. Senator Byrd is a racist who should have been gone from our government a long long time ago right along with Trent Lott. Remember when he used the “n” word and not a single Democrat said a word about it? I call that hypocrisy. And I refuse to credit that man with anything because all he’s doing is toeing the party line.
    Please please PLEASE tell me you are not a Byrd fan. Please please tell me you know this man’s history and what he has stood for in his past, that he is the consummate politician in every way – slippery forked tongue and all?

  18. Still waiting on an answer from the anti-war folks… How many protests in the last 12-13 years have you been involved in criticizing:
    1. The gassing of Kurds by Saddam, or
    2. Iraq’s lies to the UN, or
    3. The luxury items Saddam has imported under the UN Food For Oil program rather than feeding his own people, or
    4. The Iraqi invasion of Kuwait, or
    5. Iraq’s violations of several UN resolutions, or
    6. The recent statement by Tariq Aziz that they will not destroy missiles the UN teams recently found violated the 93 Mile limit, or
    7. Iraq’s failure to account for tonnes of Anthrax, Botulism, Vx and other chemical and biological agents as cited by Blix or,
    8. The massive human rights violations as detailed by Human Rights Watch and AI committed by Saddam.
    So, have you protested any of these items, or have you been saving your protesting mojo for the recent media-friendly one?

  19. you know, it’s really groovy to be a peacenik and all that, but what *i* want to know is:
    what the hell is it about freedom that pisses off those countries over there?
    i noticed that the peaceniks kept their cakehole shut after sept 11…it’s sad to think that a few thousand people have to die before someone clue’s in to the bigger picture…

  20. I’m glad you were able to speak your mind freely, Wil.
    Now, if only the people of Iraq could do the same thing.
    I just thought it was kinda ironic.

  21. I actually believe that we have a responsibility to stand up against terrorism and tyranny.
    BUT (and this is a major BUT), that role should be played in *full cooperation and in conjunction* with the UN and World Consensus. I’m ashamed of the way Rumsfeld and other in the Administration have treated due process (both on the worldwide diplomatic front, and on the human rights front -we’re arresting people and refusing them basic rights such as a lawyer). We are sacrificing foundational concepts of our country.
    Right now we’re acting like a “my way or the highway” bully, and I don’t blame our allies for giving us the finger.
    A question: what, really, is the need to go to war in the next month, vs waiting months or even a few years of intense scrutiny to ensure that Iraq has complied? Answer: a. The economic impact of projecting our troops out there that long (I, for one, will pay extra taxes to keep them out there as long as it takes, but let’s not send them to war) b. Bush doesn’t want to appear to lose face by insisting action is needed imminently, and then backing off. He is, after all, campaigning for re-election. So my friends, if we go to war, it’s for either the almighty dollar, or for Bush’s benefit. Neither is acceptable.
    To think, all this because of a few thousand miscounted chads. Sigh. A plague upon the Florida ballot system! *Go Electronic* for cripes sake!

  22. America has declared war on the entire world. It must win this war or be cast onto the scrap-heap of history.
    Naturally, some restructuring must take place. Since America is not really ready for when the oil runs out in 10-30 years (at current cosumption, given various estimates by leading energy experts) we first have to secure what remaining oil fields there are.
    Next: Coco-Cola, Levis and Nikes to replace _all_ colonial garb. It isn’t just secularism: it’s the law. Too keep the world safe for tartrazine, it is likely that Dijon, France will have to be invaded, as well. Dirty little frenshmen hogging all the mustard.
    Remember our motto: “Don’t tread on my, or think about treading on me, or disagree with me when I say you are about to tread on me, or near me. Don’t even think about it. Is that a Koran?”
    Citizens will be informed when they must report to local re-education camps. Until then, here’s some football and naked women!

  23. Oh dear or dear or dear. So your support the right of Saddam Hussain to keep terrible weapons in defiance of the UN. Well good for you. I hope you’re happy

  24. Not to sound like an idiot, but why is everyone so opposed to the military action that will happen (not might)? I refuse to call it a war unless congress declares and act of war. (Gulf War? No. No Act.) Please feel free to e-mail me @ [email protected]. I will answer and respect intelligent answers and delete all the other crap. I’m serioud here, I would really like to know. And before you send any “It’s because of the oil” please don’t because it’s not.

  25. Wil I use to respect your opinion. But this latest article shows your ignorance to the real world. You have fallen victim the “feel good” minority. And from what I’ve read in your past articles your opinion always echoes whatever the Hollywood liberals have to say.
    Why don’t you take a look at the countries supporting our War on Iraq you will find they are more than 90% of the countries in the world. Germany and France are minor players compared to all of the, now free thanks to Ronald Reagan, former Soviet States. Most if not all of those former Soviet States are with us on the War Against Iraq. Not to mention Germany has already changed their position on the war.
    Finally Wil take some time to read the news and watch Fox for some realistic views of the world.
    All the best to you and my fellow Americans who are misguided about our War on Iraq.

  26. brian: FOX has realistic views on the world??? “fair and balanced news,” right? i don’t know if you’ve noticed, but they are RARELY have democrats on any of their programs, unlike CNN, which is truly balanced with programs such as “crossfire” which present opinions from both sides. i’m sorry, but you have been misled. for realistic views, you should be willing to hear both sides of every argument, without resorting to cheap shots.(i.e. constant reference to old news of bill clinton, etc.)

  27. Bob.
    “All those deaths will be your responsibility….you demand cheap oil, you pay for it with death.”
    I *don’t* demand cheap oil. The war won’t be about oil at all, although you seem to have trouble understanding that. The issue is whether Hussein is going to be allowed mass destruction weapons or not. We already know he’s busy building them. He’s just angling for time to implement them.
    Frankly, we don’t get a whole lot of our oil from Iraq regardless.
    Kuwait (with or without an e) was effectively ours if we had simply wanted to take it. We didn’t. Saddam WILL take it if he can. If we were primarily concerned about cheap oil, we could have stayed there when last we invaded. We didn’t. We gave it back to the people who lived there.

  28. Ellen: Clinton News Network is balanced? Sounds like something a democrat would say.
    I doubt if anyone who is truly unbiased would be recognized that way. Most, if not all, would probably believe that someone is biased if they don’t agree. After all, *I* am unbiased, therefore if you don’t agree, you *are* biased.

  29. Bush won the election, fair and square. If Gore had won through the electoral college, you would be fine with it. You have to learn to remain objective and support the political system you exist in without just twisting it to suit your own ends.
    Grow up, childen.

  30. Hey Wil and friends,
    What do you think we should do about Saddam, nothing? How about we follow the french suggestion, they admit the weapons inspections are not working, so what do they recommend? More inspections! Brilliant! Maybe we should just close our eyes and do nothing, then in five years when he has nukes, and is threatning the rest of the world, maybe you and the french will come up with some good ideas how to deal with him. Remember, appeasement didnt work in the 40s and it wont work now. Im with you president bush, go get him!

  31. It takes more guts to fight for peace than to stick an American flag decal on your car, collapse on your couch and watch the horror of war unfold on CNN. If you think you want this war, please ask yourself: would you give up your son, daughter, nephews, or nieces for this cause?
    This outrage Bush is propagating is not worth one drop of American blood.

  32. ****Not to sound like an idiot, but why is everyone so opposed to the military action that will happen (not might)? I refuse to call it a war unless congress declares and act of war. (Gulf War? No. No Act.) ****
    Right, cause people don’t die in military actions. This war isn’t necessary yet. Then again, why listen to me? I’m obviously just a child that’s never experienced the real world. The US should NOT do this without UN approval.

  33. Excerpt from a speech delivered in 1933, by Major General Smedley Butler, former Commandant of the USMC.
    War is just a racket. A racket is best described, I believe, as something that is not what it seems to the majority of people. Only a small inside group knows what it is about. It is conducted for the benefit of the very few at the expense of the masses.
    I believe in adequate defense at the coastline and nothing else. If a nation comes over here to fight, then we’ll fight. The trouble with America is that when the dollar only earns 6 percent over here, then it gets restless and goes overseas to get 100 percent. Then the flag follows the dollar and the soldiers follow the flag.
    There isn’t a trick in the racketeering bag that the military gang is blind to. It has its “finger men” to point out enemies, its “muscle men” to destroy enemies, its “brain men” to plan war preparations, and a “Big Boss” Super-Nationalistic-Capitalism.
    I spent thirty- three years and four months in active military service as a member of this country’s most agile military force, the Marine Corps. I served in all commissioned ranks from Second Lieutenant to Major-General. And during that period, I spent most of my time being a high class muscle- man for Big Business, for Wall Street and for the Bankers. In short, I was a racketeer, a gangster for capitalism.
    During those years, I had, as the boys in the back room would say, a swell racket. Looking back on it, I feel that I could have given Al Capone a few hints. The best he could do was to operate his racket in three districts. I operated on three continents.

  34. Hmmm… perhaps the headlines should read like this..
    6 Billion People Worldwide do NOT March for Peace… talk about accuracy in media.
    You peace-niks have your heads in your rear ends. Woe to our children if people like you ever run the country. Oh, wait. You DID for 8 years with your boy, slick Willie. He is the reason things have gotten the way they are. You folks need a history lesson… or a lobotomy.. whichever is easiest…
    P.S. – Wil … loved you in Star Trek.. reading your lunacy on this site has now proven to me that all you can do is act… stick to what you know and keep your anti-American opinions to your self.

  35. Thank You Senator Byrd????
    You mean this Senator Byrd,”I’ve seen a lot of white niggers in my time.”??
    You mean the former Klansman Byrd???
    This is where you loose any sort of sway that you had. Blindly embracing someone because of political affiliation and blindly dismissing everyone else because of their party is akin to political racism.
    Shutting our eyes to the problems of millions just to keep us in our comfort zone is the same as killing them ourselves. Is my ease of mind worth a thousand lives of strangers? Is it worth even one of their lives?
    How many homeless and hungry did you step over on those self-aggrandizing marches. Look around you. You scream “Peace” at the cost of millions.
    A voice of my own.
    pixelBoy0

  36. Gee, JC. Since when is exercising one’s freedom of speech anti-American? The founding fathers of this nation risked (and gave) their lives to give us all the right to disagree with our government. Our government belongs to us, and if we do not agree with out country’s actions, then it is our duty to speak up. It is people like you who will eventually allow the government to silence dissent in the name of “Patriotism”.
    You are misguided, and I pity you.

  37. borg: are you calling cnn “Clinton News Network?”
    I don’t know if you’ve realized this, but clinton is no longer president. therefore, cnn, unlike fox, doesn’t constantly refer to clinton in every issue concerning democrats. also, if fox were unbiased, there would be nothing to agree/disagree with. i’m not saying i am unbiased, i’m saying that fox is biased. therefore, anyone with opinions agrees or disagrees with the dominating views (conservative) presented on the program, which is why the bush zombies will only watch fox, because they fear having their views challenged.

  38. Estimates place the number of worldwide anti-war protestors this weekend at around 2-2.5 million.
    Ironically, this is roughly the number of people who have died under the current Iraqi regime ( http://www.moreorless.au.com/killers/hussein.htm ).
    Where are the voices of support for the Kurdish and Shiite people?
    I guess marching *for* democracy isn’t as fun as marching against George Bush. Shame that the Iraqi people don’t have such freedom.

  39. All of you people are duped little flowers. Still is funny how 65% of Americans support this MUCH needed act against a VERY dangerous man. Compared to rest of you that are just on board the peace wagon because it is the cool thing to do right now. Not to mention the ill informed

  40. *sits back and waits patiently, curious to see if Wil ends up locking this thread as he has said TWICE to move these conversations to the soapbox and no one apparently paid attention…*

  41. It’s amazing that all these pro-Iraq supporters did not have the ambition to protest against the tens of thousands murdered by the Iraq gov., or the thousands murdered in NYC by those sheltered by the Iraq gov. Maybe the next attack will hit closer to home for you, then we can all look back on your marching and tell our children that you made a difference… a sad, sad difference.

  42. “I love my country. I will not let a few fanatics take it away from me.” ~wil
    Who are the fanatics? The hated Republicans, or the truly evil terrorist masterminds who mislead impressionable kids into blowing themselves up in the name of Allah?
    I love my country. I will not let a few fanatics take it away from me.

  43. Wow, there sure are a lot of angry people on both sides of the argument.
    War of any kind sucks. People die, and it’s a terrible price to pay. Especially when it is a war that is being fought for reasons that may not be totally clear to us right now.
    A lot of people want to be angry at Bush. They claim they never voted for him, he’s not their president, and that he’s a war mongering oil fiend.
    The # thing I think I’ve learned in my life is that the truth almost always falls somewhere in the middle of what the two sides claim.
    I do not think that there is anyone who can honestly say that Saddam and his regime isn’t oppressive. One look at their form of government and we can tell that. For further proof I suggest you pick up the book Bravo Two Zero. Its an account of the treatment that some SAS troops received at the hands of their hosts in Iraq once captured.
    The last war with Iraq had a couple of purposes. 1) It helped our relations with countries that are our primary sources of Oil. Not good enough to shed blood over you say? Well lets put it in another light…
    Oil is used daily for everything from production of plastics to roadways. We use it for heat, cooking, lubrication, manufacturing, transportation…
    Is it smart for us to be reliant on a fairly unstable portion of the world? No, it isn’t… However the alternatives are not yet commercially viable. Money makes the world turn folks.
    Anyway, I digress… Let’s go over the chain-reaction of what happens if the U.S. loses oil…
    Manufactured goods? Think again, no oil for the machinery. Comfort? Nope, people dependent on fuel oil for heat are screwed. Transportation? Nope, that grinds to a halt which means we cannot transport food, medicine, mail… As our oil supply dwindles, prices increase, and the country as we know it starts to grind to a halt. This includes medical services, police and fire services…
    Add in the people who work in refineries who are now out of a job. The franchise owners of gas stations. The station employees…
    There’s no really good way to solve the issue of Oil until we make a conscious effort to stop using 25% of the world’s oil consumption each year…
    Now, let’s flash back 60 years to WWII… Where the US took a separatist view of things until the Japanese attacked us for cutting off THEIR oil supply. Millions of people suffered and died at the hands of evil armies, etc… Don’t get me wrong, even the US Army is responsible for the same sort of attrocities, but that’s what war is. Attrocities. However, the one thing that the US has done after each war is rebuild the ‘liberated’ lands. That is because we recognize that politically and economially stable regions in the world are worth more to us than smoking ruins.
    Do we make money off of it in the long run? Yes. But that’s a side-product of doing what’s right. Now we’re faced with a choice of doing something now to prevent a possible issue, which of course we’d gain yet another oil-producing ally, or do we sit on our thumbs and watch our current oil producing ‘allies’ cower due to their proximity to a tyrranical country that invaded Kuwait.
    Oh, and as for us not doing any good. Here’s a little known fact about Desert Storm…
    When Saddam started launching scuds at Israel. Israel’s response was to park a couple of mobile nuke launchers in plain sight aimed towards Iraq. Had the U.S. not intervened with patriot missile batteries, the world might be a big smoking parking-lot about now with potholes from hell.
    US Foreign policy definitely needs some help. However, if we give into the ‘its not our problem’ mentality, then we’re right back where we were before WWII.
    What to think? I’m not sure. I think the spirit of a peace rally is great, but a lot of the people I’ve met who were involved were to overzealous to be level-headed about the issue. Yet I do not want the US heading off to war. It’s bad for the lives of our soldiers, its bad for the Iraqi people who are already suffering beneath the iron fist of a tyrant, and its bad for the economy of the world which revolves largely around the U.S. economy.
    I’m tired of this crap about how war is evil. We know its evil. We’ve seen its face close-up with the Oklahoma City bombing, the attack on the USS Cole, and the Sept 11th events…
    Someone once told me that people are generally good. Honestly, I think that people are generally evil and are only good when it suits their purpose for the most part.

  44. Have read some comments about a *police state* that the US has become. Bawahaha! Hey babes, go back to before the Iron Curtain fell – (thanks to conservative minded US/Euro *white* christian do-gooders )-experience-REALLY, for Christ’s sake, experience a POLICE STATE and then realise HOW good we have it in Amerika!
    Many that want peace ARE conservative, maybe christian, white – yet work behind the scenes, out of the crowd, with no exaltation or self-congratulatory blogging -”pat me on the back”, all talk but no REAL action. All i hear from the *marchers* is HATE speech towards Bush and his – really all that is SUCH a good example of where you are all *truly* coming from.
    YOU be the first to wean yourselves from your yuppie big rigs – and all else may follow. Put YOUR actions toward bettering this country and *our* dialogue with each other. All you are doing is tearing this country apart.
    Elzie

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