I went to a local park and had lunch with a friend of mine today. It’s beautiful here, but we can tell that it’s Summer’s last attempt to hold Autumn at bay, and we’ll be suffering through the misery of sixty degree afternoons soon enough. There’s even rumor of an inch of rain before the end of the year, which we both know will turn our freeways deadly. Um, it also seemed like a good excuse to walk away from the computer and enjoy actual human contact for a change. While we ate sandwiches and watched little kids chase each other, we talked about the election. We’re two small blue spots in a sea of red here, and we’d shared hopes and fears over the last several months.
“I guess we’re supposed to be gracious in victory,” I said, “but I’m profoundly offended to hear ‘we need to look forward and not backward’ and ‘we need to stop being so partisan’ from the very same fucking motherfuckers who have been telling us that we hate our country and love terrorists for the last eight years? These are the same people who worked really hard to make sure that I and everyone who didn’t agree with their blind support of Bush and Bush policies didn’t feel welcome in our own fucking country for eight years!”
I looked down at my hands, which had involuntarily clenched into fists. I felt a frightening and unexpected, uncharacteristic fury rise in my chest.
“I want to grab these people by the throat and scream at them ‘HOW DO YOU LIKE IT FUCKER?! YOU LOST! YOU FAIL! YOU GO HOME NOW!’”
I kept my voice low, but was really worked up, shocked and horrified at the level of anger I was feeling.
We looked at each other for a moment. I was embarrassed by my outburst. This really isn’t like me. Fortunately, my friend is incredibly cool and unflappable. She is also incredibly wise. She put her sandwich down and wiped the corners of her mouth with a paper napkin.
She pointed out at the different people in the park and said, “They are home. We share this country, all of us, whether we like it or not.
“We voted against intolerance for people that don’t share ‘the right’ views because we and people we respect and admire have been the victims of intolerance for too long. We voted against hypocrisy and fear and hate. We voted for a chance to change.”
I unclenched my fists and looked at little half-moons in the palms of my hands. “I should feel celebratory. I should feel happy and relieved. Why in the world do I suddenly feel so angry?”
“Seething quietly and privately is understandable and totally warranted. Just, every time you want to grab someone by the throat, try to remember how both Obama and McCain have always reacted to boos from their audiences. One man said ‘we don’t need any more of that’ – and that’s the administration we voted for. Because we don’t need any more of that. We need to chip away at the havens of hate in this country until there is nothing left for the haters to fight with. Because that is going to be the biggest payback of all.
“Someday, the people that ‘don’t feel welcome’ in a tolerant and just place aren’t going to feel welcome anywhere.
“We don’t need to take any shit from anyone, but we can not become the bullies we’ve hated. Or else we didn’t win anything at all.”
While I processed all of this, she smiled and added, “Yes, my horse is very high, and I like it that way. I can see a long way from up here.”
“Damn. You’re wise,” I said. “I’m going to have to write down ‘We don’t need any more of that’ and use it to get over eight years of resentment. It’s going to take awhile to get over being called a traitor and being told to, effectively, ‘shut up and sing,’ but you’re absolutely right. We can not become the bullies we’ve hated.”
We finished our sandwiches, and walked through the park before we both had to get home to our families.
“Maybe I shouldn’t have had a second cup of coffee this morning,” I offered.
“I’m sure you’ll get your cool back once it wears off.”
I hope she’s right.
Afterthought: This doesn’t mean that progressives suddenly drop our agenda to fundamentally change things. This doesn’t mean that we don’t fight for what we believe in over the next four and hopefully eight years. This means that, as human beings and as Americans, we can choose to live in John McCain’s vision of an angry, divided, fearful America, or Barack Obama’s vision of a tolerant, united, hopeful America. It’s not going to be easy for me, especially after the hateful, divisive campaign McCain ran and eight years of being screamed at by George Bush’s True Believers. But as my friend said, “We need to chip away at the havens of hate in this country until there is nothing left for the haters to fight with. Because that is going to be the biggest payback of all … we can not become the bullies we’ve hated. Or else we didn’t win anything at all.”
I totally agree with everything your friend stated. She’s wise, and reminds me of myself. :o)
Your outburst is normal and justified. Also, it’s cathartic because once that’s out of your system, your brain gets smart again. THAT was the true brain fart. Hot gas? Passed. And now we get down to the business of making the country better through changing what’s broken.
This election, in and of itself, has changed people. Republicans are talking about easing up on the right-wing super conservative stances so that they can win another election. Even though it’s just pandering now, the next generation will see the new stance and we have moved in the right direction.
@Teekno, SAL9000, jansob, et al.,
You are so missing Wil’s point. He revealed his darker (yet understandable) thoughts, shared his struggle to follow the better angels of his nature, and, through his friend, appealed to other Democrats to do the same. But you skim over his post in an effort to find something to take issue with, ignoring the surrounding text that qualifies it. You wag your finger at Wil for “harboring” these feelings and don’t give him well deserved credit for combating them.
Regarding McCain, I just don’t know what to think about the man. Was the senator who gave that gracious concession speech the real McCain?
As a Canadian, I look forward to not hating the U.S. any more. It’s been a heavy burden to carry these last 8 years. I still don’t know if I can forgive you for electing him that second time after we all knew what he was. At least there is some hope now. I look forward to leaving the hate behind.
@ Jess:
You’re succumbing to the Leftists’ Hegemony of Tolerance; that is, the conundrum that is claiming intolerance of anything that doesn’t toe the accepted tolerance. (That is, intolerance of intolerance is not tolerance.)
I never once stated anything related to restricting thought, action, or otherwise forcing/compelling/whatevering others to accept my POV. That here, as in most realms, is primarily the dominion of the Left.
@Mac Guy & Jess,
Hear, hear!
@ ReadReadWrite:
Not at all missing the point. This blog entry typified the Leftist mentality of external sanction.
Humanity evolved to look out for itself, not conscript others for the greater good, or predicate happiness that on the irrelevant or the uncontrollable. External sanction and validation is chasing rainbows.
LOL – how many truly content and fulfilled liberals do you know? Very few I surmise – they’re too busy focusing on things that either don’t concern them or that they can’t control.
Hey everybody!
Ta Hell with all this crap… Lets all hate on DRM and Jack Thompson for a while so we can feel better!
@SAL9000: While I appreciate the definition of sorts, again, you’re speaking politicospeak. Leftists Hegemony of Tolerance? Do they have a dictionary you’ve memorized for all these terms? It’s like referring to the Five Geek Social Fallacies to people who’ve no idea what that is.
Also, I don’t see how that viewpoint is ‘leftist’ – truthfully, I see it as semantics. Intolerance of anything (including intolerance) is still just that, intolerance. I’ve no problem calling myself intolerant of someone else’s viewpoint when I’m being so, even if it’s me being intolerant of their intolerance. Note, that doesn’t claim whether it’s right, wrong, good, bad, or purple; it’s still being intolerant. O_o I don’t understand how that makes anyone’s thoughts ‘leftist’.
You’re correct, you’re not ‘forcing’ anyone to accept your POV. However, what I mean to point out is that your POV of needing to say something is ‘gooey fail’ and (to paraphrase) OMG LEFTIST BS is neither constructive nor positive, and ridiculing others for not being positive (ahem, ‘tolerant’) about said negativity is quite hypocritical when you started out negatively. So there, hey; it’s not about ‘tolerance’ of negativity, it’s about expecting people to respond positively to your negativity and then ridiculing/patronizing them (and tossing Capitalized RightSpeak) when they don’t. BTW, that approach will never get you anywhere, though, apparently, it might make you feel better than others in the process. Just sayin’. 🙂
For the rest, I refer you to ReadReadWrite and Mer, who’ve summed up perfectly. How about seeing it as a human reaction, rather than leftrightblackwhitepurple?
@ Jess
I didn’t bring tolerance into the mix; the blog entry did; I merely called it the paradox of its usage.
I don’t want my approach to get me anywhere, actually. In a macro sense, the more that people expect a free lunch, the less likely they’re out there starting business, developing real estate, buying equities, and engaging in other endeavors I primarily concern myself with.
I do like pointing out however the inherent paradoxes of leftist ideology, and reminding people of the principals upon which America was founded. Gives me a warm fuzzy.
Let’s make sure we’re clear on our terminology, in particular, the core of the Democratic party vs. that of the Republican party.
Democrat: Broader central government involvement, less state autonomy. The government assumes direct responsibility for public welfare by being the source of the programs, establishing a “common standard” across all states.
Republican: Lesser central government involvement, more state autonomy. The government encourages free enterprise to handle the issues of public welfare, allowing the central government to focus on other issues such as defense and foreign relations, only to step in when there’s a void.
Simple affiliation with one party or another does not imply that one is 100% behind the views of its members who happen to have become elected officials (thus, I’m a gay-friendly atheistic Republican – go figure?). The personal, sadly, often becomes the political all too often, and judgment becomes clouded; the perception of a particular party is the result of the actions of its members, and the negative always outweighs the positive. Thus, Democrats become the tree-huggin’ hippies from San Francisco, while the Republicans are the old gun-lovin’ codgers from the South.
We all need to stop the name-calling from both sides of the fence and get back to our political roots. The continuation of adversarial badgering does nothing but perpetuate the cycle of hatred. To me, Democrat or Republican, it doesn’t matter. Pick your political philosophy and stick with it, work with it, work through it, and effect some POSITIVE change for once.
I’ve always been respectful towards my Democrat brethren, and the majority of them have extended the same courtesy. We have WONDERFUL conversations together, and once we set aside our differences, we’re able to put together some amazing plans. The cycle of hatred has stopped with me. Let it stop with you, too.
I too am a secular (read: atheist), not anti-gay conservative.
However, the US constitution and its amendments purposefully set the stage for a two party system, making it inherently adversarial (two players = a winner and a loser).
Not only is a two party system inherently more stable (as in, the devil you know is better than the devil you don’t) but competition ensures that those will to do what it takes to win have implicit mandate.
This is not an endorsement of infighting, bickering, posturing, hatred, etc., but of fierce partisan compromise borne of necessity, not altruist tenets of cooperation, compassion, niceness, etc. Those not willing to fight to win deserve to lose.
What your friend said was beautiful.
Thank you Wil, for so eloquently expressing what so many of us are feeling. You rock. http://peasweet13.livejournal.com/
@SAL9000,
You say, “Humanity evolved to look out for itself, not conscript others for the greater good, or predicate happiness that on the irrelevant or the uncontrollable. External sanction and validation is chasing rainbows.”
If you’re saying that “every man for himself” is our natural and therefore preferable, mode of behavior, and that anything else is delusional, I must disagree. Although it’s true that we’d never sleep again if we wailed over every single instance of injustice or suffering, and although you’ll likely dismiss me as an Obamabot, I say we could use a little more of “I am my brother’s keeper.” And regarding your natural selection argument, I submit to you that cooperation within groups contributed to the survival of those groups, perpetuating the genes they had in common.
Regarding what you call “external sanction” and similar efforts to influence thought and behavior, that’s the point of not only most writing but most communication. If thought and behavior is unchangeable we might as well not say anything. I think you tried to address this apparent contradiction by saying that pointing out liberal fallacies gave you the “warm fuzzies,” but are we to believe that the prospect of the merest nudge of persuasion never, even for a nanosecond, occurred to you?
Regarding liberal exercises in futility, I’ll admit that idealists often fight losing battles, but I think that’s better than erring on the side of throwing one’s hands up in defeat reflexively.
The line between the doable and the futile can only be found through effort. Yes, that can be a prescription for misery. It can make idealists look very foolish (inspiring the occasional LOL). It’s certainly not a reliable route to an individual’s happiness; in fact, the hope/delusion that things can and should always be made better will to some extent rule out an individual’s contentment. But the delusion that we know what’s impossible without trying and failing would have ruled out much of what has been accomplished over the past century-and-then-some, seemingly against the odds
A p.s. to an already ridiculously long comment (sorry, can’t help it):
Although the stage was set for the two party system, many of the Founding Fathers (Adams was one, I think) were horrified by its emergence. “Party” was an epithet to them. Of course it seems obvious now that they were being unrealistic. But would the Founding have happened without foolish idealists in the first place?
“I should feel celebratory. I should feel happy and relieved. Why in the world do I suddenly feel so angry?”
This reminds me of an interview I read with an old East German woman very soon after the Berlin wall came down. I don’t remember her exact words, but she said that she could not share in the joy of the rest of the world because she was too angry that the 28 years she had been forced to live under the oppression of the Soviet bloc was now being chalked up as a mistake. She said something like, “I am happy for the unborn [meaning future generations, I guess] but angry for my own children’s wasted lives.” It was powerful.
For those of us still upset about Prop 8, here is a small thing to do.
http://www.mormonsstoleourrights.com/
It pains me that Prop 8 passed. I look forward to it being overturned again, or to us repealing it in the next election.
That said, gay rights is not a viable national issue right now. We like to think that Obama won big, but really, he only won by 6.3%. Only 3.2% of the people needed to switch sides for our team to lose. The best we can hope for from Obama on gay rights is that he squash any national attempts to limit. With a Democratic Congress, we shouldn’t need to worry about that for at least two years.
For gay rights to become a platform plank for a President, one of two things needs to happen. Either the President needs to win a second term election BIG (at least 55/45, probably bigger), or we need to be successful at the ballot in at least CA, NY, MA, MN and two more blue states. With the Supreme Court stacked to the right, we can’t put our hopes in them for years to come. We have to keep making the case to Californians. Prop 22 passed with 61% yes. Prop 8 passed with only 52.5% yes. We’ve made a lot of headway in 8 years. We just need to change the minds of another 2.6% of Californians in order to knock down the first domino. With enough determination, the rest will fall.
@ ReadReadWrite:
MYOBing isn’t necessarily “ever man for himself” or “man is an island.” Man is not a cooperative animal per se, man is a contractual animal – man’s innate nature is not, “what can I do to help?” but “what’s in it for me?”
As to the external sanction tenet – I was referring to the fundamental premise of Leftist ideology. The Leftist measures his worth on his ability to control others thoughts and actions; from the social to the economic, the ideology sprouts from collectivism which without (striving for) full participation, is DOA.
Idealists are more than willing to search for that line, but in my world view there is no line. Freedom, the rule of law, and private property are pretty stark concepts.
I don’t think the Founders were foolish idealists. Risk takers? Sure. Private property, freedom, and the rule of law, are the innate states of man.
Thank you Wil, for sharing this.
I’ve linked to this from my journal to help my conservative friends understand where some of anger has been coming from, and to help my liberal friends understand that we NEED to put that anger behind us, to move forward.
I want to remind all of them that we are all people, sometimes caught up in emotions, but all part of this country and all part of making it work.
“We can not become the bullies we’ve hated. Or else we didn’t win anything at all.”
This quote is a keeper. We should all say that to ourselves every day for the next four (eight?) years.
Wil, I’m sorry, but it’s going to take more than that for us to forget EIGHT LONG YEARS of the most vicious bile directed at us on the Right by the people on the Left. We got called xenophobes, Christofascists, rednecks, racists, Nazis, Gestapo, fascists, morons, and a bunch of things I won’t sully your blog by posting here. We had to endure people on the Left calling for the assassination of our elected leaders, holding signs saying “We Support Our Troops When They SHOOT Their Officers,” and marching in the streets in support of terrorists who want us DEAD. (ALL of us. That means YOU on the Left, too.)
You don’t get off the hook that easy.
Tell me this: Will you stand with us when Obama seeks to reinstate the Fairness Doctrine and eliminate our voices from all forms of media? Will you stand with us when Obama seeks to impose involuntary servitude on our children in the name of “national service”? Will you stand with us when Obama seeks to take away our Second Amendment rights?
When you’re ready to answer “yes” to those questions…THEN we can talk about “getting over it” or “not needing any more of that.”
Until then…well, I hope that we won’t descend to the levels the Left has been occupying for these past eight years. But we will be watching. And we will document every slip-up, every broken promise, every gaffe. And, in 2010 and 2012, we will be there, to say to America, “We Told You So.”
“We can not become the bullies we’ve hated. Or else we didn’t win anything at all.”
I do not mean to trivialize this statement at all when I say this, but I NEED this on a bumper sticker — your friend is, indeed, wise and it needs to be shared.
Wil, I think I can sum up your reaction in one word: Backlash.
It’s the same reason some women turn uber-feminist and declare that all men should be castrated and used as slave labor. You get to the point of “I’m mad as hell and I’m not going to take it anymore” after years of oppression/abuse and when you finally act on breaking out of that oppressed state, the pendulum will sometimes swing WAAAAAY to the opposite side.
We’ve had eight years of the Bush administration’s idiocy and abuse of power, and you snapped in an extreme way. I think that’s a pretty human reaction, really.
Here’s the thing though: I think you’re self-aware enough to realize you’ve gone to the Dark Side and after you have your screaming fit, you’ll fall back to center.
It’s when we DON’T allow ourselves to have that screaming fit that we run into trouble. Emotional repression can lead to scenarios that include bell towers and high-powered rifles.
Good on you for being healthy enough to flip out so you can regain balance again at some point.
As a Muslim American, I also had the same urge. I really liked your friend’s response and believe that is in incredibly important that we remain united. I was blown away by the difference in response from McCain’s constituents (they booed Obama’s name) and Obama’s.
I’m not only defined by my faith or even my country. I’m also a mother, a wife, a daughter, a sister, a writer. There’s so much to choose from when we look for common ground with another person. It’s when we don’t look for that common ground that we fall into fear and hatred–it stems from ignorance.
I recently published a piece on racialicious(dot)com that looks at what Obama as president means to me, a Muslim mother. I was thrilled with the response of one athiest reader who stated he also used to be filled with this type of hate. If he’s changed, then it’s a lesson to me not to fall into the trap. And your friend’s words are a rock solid reminder. I kind of wish I had a shirt with the entire exchange on it.
I actually feel bad for Obama because I fear he’s in a no-win situation.
There will probably be much guffawing and schaudenfreude from morons like Rush Limbaugh and his ilk when the calendar reads February 20, 2009, and all the problems of the world haven’t been solved by the new guy.
Because, yeah, the mess that took a decade or more to make is going to be cleaned up within a month or two or a couple years.
But I KNOW that people are just waiting to pounce on Obama when he doesn’t immediately cure this nation’s ills – and maybe he won’t be able to cure them at all, much less quickly.
I hope he’s able to make some healing changes. I hope he’s allowed to create prosperity for our people, without sour-grapes jerks doing their damnedest to make sure he fails. I hope he’s given the opportunity and the help he needs to succeed.
I think Obama has the gumption necessary to get in there and roll his sleeves up, and I believe he has this country’s best interests at heart.
Hopefully the rat bastards who want to see him crash and burn won’t be stupid enough to cut off their noses to spite their faces, doing crap that will hinder Obama’s progress and thus screwing THEMSELVES in the process. That would be the highest level of dumbassery.
Oh, yes. Conservative AM talk radio will EXPLODE. If you people think it was a juggernaut before, just wait a few months.
The RNC is already gearing up the hit machine to prepare for the 2010 midterm elections.
I think they’ll have plenty o’ fodder in an Obama administration. The RNC will have to move left to have any hope of enticing back the voting blocks that won it for Obama, so I’ve pretty much checked out of the political process.
I really don’t understand how you guys work yourself up into this kind of frenzy.
You don’t like the rantings of Hannity? Then don’t listen to him. I certainly have a hard time listening to people like Frankin or Moore and their absurd rants. Freedom of speech is a bitch like that.
As for Obama, I think it’s great he got elected. I didn’t vote for him, but I’m totally willing to give him a chance and see if he lives up to his wonderful victory speech and reference to Lincoln. The selection of Emanuel as his chief of staff is certainly a fine start. 😉
Will,
You ought to read Senator McCain’s congratulatory speech to President-elect Obama on his website http://www.johnmccain.com before it goes away. I’m hoping that will assuage your temper tantrum.
These are two great men having a contest of ideas, the words coming out of their mouths are the source and should be taken in their totality. What pisses us off (me anyway) are the infinity of talking heads who are devisive assholes putting words in everyone’s mouth (especially based on a 5-second sound-bite)and twisting meaning all out of shape to suit some personal agenda. It’s so obvious to anyone with a clear head that FOX and CNN report the same event so differently it’s like watching the BBC and Al Jazeera report on the Iraq war.
What’s supposed to happen are great debates, exchanges of ideas, and a final vote. I feel sort of cheated that the debates weren’t that great in my opinion, but you can’t fault the candidates for not trying.
It’s a fact that neither candidate has any real workable solutions to any of our myraid problems. Just happy Kool Aid talk some people love to hear.
Now at least only one of them are talking. And I hope that a clear-headed person, after listening to today’s speech on the economy, realizes that things haven’t been narrowed down much beyond the magic words “stimulus package”. I was hoping to look at the innards of Jan. 20, 2009 legislation posted on-line. What was I thinking?
A big Hu-Ra, the Bush years are over. Even though things are messed up and looking like they’re outta control, I’m looking forward to seeing what a smart guy can do.
I’m really pissed off at my government, I think we all are. So, let us commune on that thought … now the future awaits.
Now get out there and earn your share of that $700,000,000,000.00 to pay off the gambling debt of the fat cats. Me, I’m doing a ‘John Gault’.
Actually, it’s “Galt” 🙂
A Galtian strike is about the only type I’d endorse.
Keeping that anger in check is extremely tough dude so I can completely understand your reaction. No reason to be ashamed at all.
As for this country…I’m of the opinion that as long as we stay on top of what these people we’ve elected are doing with their time and our resources then we can maybe do all right in the end.
But that’s the thing – we have to keep an eye on these people or they’ll steal the silverware. Er…so to speak anyway.
“John McCain’s vision of an angry, divided, fearful America, or Barack Obama’s vision of a tolerant, united, hopeful America”
Sorry Wil, but that was not John McCain’s vision. That is your bias at work. You were pretty nasty towards McCain as well. Living in NC, we got to see plenty of negative ads from Obama that you may not have seen on Cali. And a lot of the left want the right to forget the Bush = Hitler and all that other crap that has been out there for 8 years. Good luck with that one.
As to Barack Obama’s vision, the irony of Obama supporters in California being a huge voting block for Prop. 8 is a delicious one.
Perhaps the way to move forward for all of us, you included, is right at the top of your blog:
“Don’t Be A Dick!”
Wil, political disagreement doesn’t equate to hatred. A “you’re with me or against me” attitude isn’t healthy, either. I’m sure there are a lot of folks who, like me, disagree with you on some issues but still enjoy your writing.
jeghan, from the “JOBS” page at change.gov:
“The Obama-Biden Transition Project does not discriminate on the basis of race, color, religion, sex, age, national origin, veteran status, sexual orientation, gender identity, disability, or any other basis of discrimination prohibited by law.”
Works for me.
Opinionator said: “As to Barack Obama’s vision, the irony of Obama supporters in California being a huge voting block for Prop. 8 is a delicious one.”
Opinionator, how can you be completely sure all the YES votes on Prop 8 were from Obama supporters?
There ARE other presidential candidates from which to choose, not just the two main parties. Perhaps the 500,000 votes that made up the difference between Yes and No were from folks who either voted for a third party OR from folks who didn’t vote for the presidential election at all. [It’s not as crazy as it sounds. My husband was an election judge and one guy went through the process of standing in line, getting his ballot, going to the booth…and not filling in ANY of the circles.]
Obviously, I’m not stating that’s the case – it’s quite possible that of the 6.3 people who voted for Obama, a half million of them also voted YES on Prop 8. I don’t pretend to know the answer.
Unless you have hard data to back up your statement, you probably shouldn’t assume its truth either.
Okay, make that the 6.3 MILLION people who voted for Obama. Not 6.3. My bad.
We progressives must keep in mind that we are unwelcome guests in their country – a country where they have been manipulated out of their birthright control position. Its a temporary situation that will have to endure until they overcome us in 4 years. The mindset is that we are wrong and are incapable of seeing the error of our ways. They will continue to be just as nasty and arrogant as always. But you are right, we must not give in, we must not be moveable. Compromise is not acceptable. Yes, that is rigid, but rigidity is something they can respect. Anything less (e.g. spineless Democrats in 2000) and we identify ourselves as a weak enemy.
Hey Wil,
Not to sound like a psycho fangirl or anything but I came across this post via the Bad Astronomy website, registered who the blog is maintained by and decided I have to make a TypeKey account just to tell you: You’re made of pure awesome. Thank you for making my day.
I don’t know why; maybe it’s because of my job but I’ve always written off meeting bigname celebrities as not a “real” interaction; movie stars aren’t real people with real emotions and everyday concerns. 😛 Now I will never think that again.
You’re awesome. You’re intelligent and passionate…and you’ve probably influenced quite a few people into voting for change. 🙂
I feel so awesome that I got to play Rock Band with you! (Sorry I had no idea what I was doing; normally I play the Bass…) ^-^
http://www.emmaleenguyen.com/wil.jpg
Topaz,
I did not make it up. African American voters were out for Obama in huge numbers and overwhelmingly voted for Prop. 8. Read here:
http://tinyurl.com/6yprcs
This has led to protesters in using the N-word. Read more here:
http://tinyurl.com/658mqw
Sorry to disappoint you. And before you throw it out there, I did not say Obama supporters were the only ones doing so. The second link has a huge list of groups supporting Prop 8. As I said, the irony is rich. Especially since blacks seems to be getting the lion’s share of the criticism.
Topaz,
No one said ALL the votes came from any one group. You made the assumption. I referred to the fact that groups that supported Obama were a large bloc of votes for Pro 8.
Being gracious in victory is equally as important as being a good loser. I look back in time at two men who could not have been farther apart politically and yet found a way to be friends: Ronald Reagan and Tip O’Neil. We could learn something from them.
Also,how about we spend that energy we want to waste yelling at each other, on building up our country and give our new president some help.
http://www.goinggreenaccidently.blogspot.com
One thing that stuns me is the idea that people on the left managed to feel out of place under Bush. I hardly knew anyone who wasn’t making snide comments about him 10 times a day! The few “conservatives” (By that I mean anyone who disagreed with Daily Kos) pretty much just kept quiet. Guess it makes a big difference where you are.
But no, I won’t be staying. Although my lifestyle differs very little from the people around me, I make too much money….I’m about to get slapped with enough taxes that it makes more sense to just throttle back the business, close it and retire. I’m not interested in working 60 hours weeks to see half of my income get sucked into the gaping maw of the IRS. I’ll be retiring to a place where my skills and talents can be usefully volunteered without yards of paperwork…. and with more gratitude.
Wil is right, there is no place here for we who are not followers of The One.
Bye, and good luck.
Just remeber when you say…
“This doesn’t mean that we don’t fight for what we believe in”
In order to NOT be an intolerant hypocrite you have to accept other peoples view too. Even if you don’t like them.
And while I am certainly no fan of G.W. remember the JMac more than once stood up for Obama at his rallies despite being booed by his own supporters.
There is many levels of intolerance part of both parties. Extremely judgmental, prejudice blind to their own political parties flaws and hatreds. Best way to keep your geek cool is to not be one of them. Learn to be honest about the flaws of both sides. Political parties lie. Its what they do. McCain and Obama both said things during the campaign that they knew they would or could not do once in office. If you want I can post a list.
I know the taste of welfare cheese. I know the pride of being a Marine. And though I now live in San Diego I have watched both parties destroy the economy near my home just north of Detroit. I will spare you the tales I can tell.
I think it’s ironic that my post that was critical (not mean mind you, but critical) of an Obama presidency was deleted. 2nd Ammendments a bitch, ain’t it? Hey, whatever works for you, I guess. It’s your blog. Just remember though, by not allowing me my 2nd Ammendment rights to free speech, you just did to me what you accuse the Republicans of doing all the time…using their power to shut up the little man.
Ignatz, I’m pretty sure you mean the FIRST Amendment, the one guaranteeing free speech rights, not the SECOND Amendment, the one guaranteeing the right to bear arms. Using the Second Amendment to guarantee your free speech is a little uncalled for in these circumstances.
I was impressed by McCain’s concession speech, and genuinely hope that Obama will tap him for advice and opinions. I wasn’t so impressed with his hiring of Rove’s “brain” trust during the last months of his campaign.
Oh, and I voted for Bob Barr. Anyone else?
The greatest danger in fighting evil is that you may eventually become your enemy.
I’m still hearing and reading vile hateful things from people who’s responsibility it is to know better.
Ok, one more comment that I heard from a British friend that really hit home with me. He said: “Conservatives in the US tend to think that their opponents believe what they do because they are mistaken or ignorant (things that might be changeable). Liberals tend to think their opponents believe what they do because they are evil and cannot be converted.”
That certainly goes a way to explaining the reactions I’ve seen.
The right are saying that Obama’s plans will not work and the pendulum will swing back eventually (ie: people’s ideas will change), while the left is planning to restructure things so the right will never have a voice again. Between the Fairness Doctrine, lax immigration and voter ID rules, the new social ostracism of unbelievers, and the President and 2 compliant Houses of Congress, I don’t see much future for any dissenting voices.
Hopefully Obama’s vision of a tolerant, united America also includes addressing the misogyny his campaign so greatly benefited from. The message from this campaign is that any young boy can grow up to be president, but any young girl can only grow up to be a “shrill bitch”.
Trust me, it’s not just conservatives who are pissed off right now. Many liberal feminists like myself are as well.
Jdl, “Well, Obama won fair and square, and in January he will be my president. I disagree with him on nearly every issue he stands for, but he’s the man in charge now. I’ll wait until he does something wrong to criticize him, and then it will be the action and not the man that I take exception to. And the thing is, most every Republican that I know behaves this way.”
I take it you didn’t know any Republicans following Bill Clinton’s first election. One thing I’ve learned following this election is that conservatives have very selective long-term memories.