Everyone who is upset about the REAL ID act I mentioned on Monday needs to immediately head over to ArsTechnica, and read this story, written by Hannibal:
The big news of the past two days is the impending passage of the Real ID act. I’m going to spare you any kind of detailed analysis of the ID and database aspects of this bill for two reasons a) they’re already covered very well in sources I’ll list below, and b) this bill contains a truly bizarre provision that caused a run on tinfoil hats in the blogosphere when it was first introduced, but has now dropped out of all coverage of this bill that I’ve read so far. (You’d think a clause that uses an obscure and never-before-invoked part of the Constitution to place the secretary of DHS above both the Supreme Court and the Constitution itself would get more coverage, but more on that in a moment.)
More on that, indeed.
Section 102 of H.R. 418 would amend the current provision to require the Secretary of Homeland Security to waive any law upon determining that a waiver is necessary for the expeditious construction of the border barriers. Additionally, it would prohibit judicial review of a waiver decision or action by the Secretary and bar judicially ordered compensation or injunction or other remedy for damages alleged to result from any such decision or action.
To understand what this business about prohibiting judicial review means, you have to know two things. First, you have to know a bit about the contested history of judicial review. Depending on who you talk to, the Federal judiciary’s power to overturn a law or to put a stop to an official act of government on the grounds that the law or act is unconstitutional and/or a violation of basic rights is either a core constitutional principle that ensures the rule of law and protects the rights of minorities from the “tyranny of the masses” (e.g. from Brown v. the Board of Education to Roe v. Wade) , or it’s an affront to democratic governance and the chief enabler of left-wing “judicial activism.”
Okay, prohibiting judicial review of anything is absolutely insane. Without judicial review of laws, how to we have a balanced government? How do we protect our constitutional rights when unconstitutional laws are passed? How do we prevent the tyranny of the majority? Does this mean that the United States ceases to be a nation of laws, and becomes a nation of men?
Let’s look back at what I wrote on Monday:
The US Congress, the lawmakers who derive their power from the consent of the governed, are about to take a huge step toward turning our country into a police state, and they’re doing it without any debate at all.
It’s bad enough that Congress passed legislation which fundamentally changes our right to privacy, and possibly violates the Fourth and Tenth Amendments to the Constitution, but they’ve also taken away our access to the courts (right now it’s just in cases related to this loosely-defined “expeditious construction of the border barriers”, but don’t think for a second that it will stop there) and they did it without a single word of debate. That these provisions — which are overwhelmingly opposed by the a vast majority of Americans — were snuck into a must-pass bill, and passed without debate is irresponsible at best, and criminal at worst. This is not democracy. This is fascism.
You should really read the whole story, where Hannibal sums it up for us:
Congress has crafted a completely unprecedented provision that guts the principle of judicial review by granting the DHS secretary complete and total immunity from the courts when it comes to the construction of “barriers and roads” in this one specific geographical region, and they’ve buried this provision inside a national ID card act which is itself attached to a large military appropriations bill that no Congressperson in their right mind would vote against (money for the troops and all that).
[. . .]
As a postscript, the icing on the cake of this whole thing has to be the way that the Republican sponsors of the bill actually voted down a proposed provision in the national ID card part of the law that would prevent the government from using the Real ID database as a national database of gun owners
Of course. Why am I not surprised? The Republicans in Congress don’t care at all about upholding the Constitution. They have abandoned their traditional belief in limited, non-intrusive government. They are the collective bitch of the Extreme Religious Right and groups like the NRA. They are tyrants, and Democrats who allowed this to pass without discussion or debate are cowards.
As I wrote on Monday, the leadership in this Congress is out of touch and out of control. If this doesn’t call for a general strike, I don’t know what does.
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Gee, glad I live in Canada. Of course, we are about as messed up. But at least we can console ourselves with large helpings of poutine!
This is certainly a dirty, disingenuous move on the part of the Congresscritters. Unfortunately, this is a common tactic – add some unrelated, controversial provision as a “rider” to a bill that is popular and close to a vote.
I would certainly encourage everyone to write and call your reps and Senators – keep in mind that a lot can change between the time a bill is first passed by one side of the Congress, and the time it is actually enacted.
Finally, Congress can “try” to do anything they want. They often do, even when it’s clearly unconstitutional. As much as some people complain about the current Supreme Court, they have had some real balls in the last 10 years in terms of shooting down laws that go beyond Congress’ authority. In this case, Congress can no more “exempt” a law it passed from judicial review than it can wave its hand and “exempt” the law from being presented and signed by the President. In other words, this whole premise is ridiculous.
You know it passed the Senate on a 100-0 vote? I’m a Dem, but I’m mad as hell at everybody. Not a single one was against it. Not even the usual token protest vote. Sad.
Wil – I’m glad you called them the “Extreme Religious Right” because I have sort of considered myself a member of the religious right for years. But the bills that are passing Congress are outrageous, even to me. I’m conservative, but these folks are nuts.
Indeed. Soon the jackboots will be kicking in YOUR doors… It is scary and sad to see a nation that used to stand for such noble things as Peace and Liberty and Justice For All becoming what it is today.
Wil,
Please take a moment and visit: http://www.infowars.com/index.html
I came across this site (created by Alex Jones a radioshow host based in Texas)a few days ago while doing a search for the Nat.ID on google. The broad depth of the information on this site is mind blowing and very disturbing. He seems to be very credible.
Anyway, I’d like to know what you think. Thanks in advance.
Fats
Politicians are getting worse! There once was a time when they actually thought the voting public had an intellect. Do they think no one would notice? Maybe more of the problem with politicians these days is that they don’t care or respect what the voting public thinks. Pushing this bill through a case in point…even in Canada we have a Liberal minority government have lost touch with the voting public. They (the minority governent) just lost a non-confidence vote in Parliment which should bring down the government. The Prime Minister said that it really wasn’t a confidence vote at all just a trial run on one… Huh!
Do they think we’re idiots? At least that’s all we have to contend with up here…unless the US government decides that Canada would look better as a US state and attaches the invasion order to another “support the troops” bill. In that case we’re screwed!
Keerist!! In case of emergency, keep your passport handy.
Considering how prevalent air travel is in this country, we’re in effect saying that you need travel papers to go from state to state. Welcome to the Soviet States of America.
-Chris
This gets uglier and uglier.
But, I just realized something interesting and would like to advise everybody not to fall into the trap.
This bill was described by the MSM as “must-pass” bill. Really, besides an “Act of War” resolution while we are under attack (in which case, no President has ever bothered to wait to get one), there really isn’t any such thing. The MSM made this SEEM like a “must-pass” so that they could paint anybody who went up against it as being either “an anti-War nutcase” or “anti troops.” It’s sad that Democratic Senators don’t believe their constituents would understand the explanation “I voted against that funding because they tacked on something that had nothing to do with funding the troops.” Sure, there would be ads against them in the next election saying “Senator X voted against the troops,” but Senator X could reply “My opponent thinks you are as stupid as dirt when he tells you that I voted against the troops. I did no such thing. Are you really THAT stupid?”
Point is, the Democrats WANTED the cover of it supposedly being a “must pass” bill. Had this bill not passed, the war wouldn’t have suddenly stopped. Troops wouldn’t suddenly have been without bullets or body armor (any more than they ALREADY ARE). The free world wouldn’t have come to a complete stop. Had 45 Democrats said “No, that’s just NOT going to happen. Take that out, or pass it 55 to 45 and we’ll make a POINT of the fact that you were willing to sell out Democracy without debate.”
But again, the Democrats decided to “choose their battles” and probably figured they would strike it down in court.
Personally, I am losing faith and becoming VERY afraid.
The Days of Decision are coming. We are frogs begin slow-cooked, and by the time we realize the water is boiling, we won’t have the strength to jump out of the pot. Perhaps we already don’t.
Charlie L
Portland, Oregon
[email protected]
Republicans lie and innocent people die.
Republicans steal and give to their rich friends, leaving just an IOU for our kids to pay off.
Republicans cheat and think they are “moral.”
We must flush away all Republicans in ’06 and ’08.
Wil,
I consider myself a conservative and a republican and I am very much against the Real ID Act. I have contacted my senator and urged him to vote against HR 418. I was just in Washington DC and I wish I had been able to read your blog and find out about this while I was there and able to speak to my representative and senators in person.
I urge you not to generalize Republicans in your writing. I know it’s hard to not do that, but as I’m sure all Democrats aren’t for abortion and gay rights please know that all Republicans don’t agree with everything that is said and done by the party. I actually hate voting within a party. The best man – or woman – for the job should be elected to the office.
Crouton:
I don’t want to get into a “yahoo forms” type discussion on Wil’s forum (it’s too damn nice a place), and Wil, if you think this post has gone over the line, please remove it.
But, people need to understand this basic principle…
THIS IS GERMANY IN 1932.
The Republican party is following an AGENDA and anybody who supports them is complicit in the success of their agenda.
You can’t say: “I’m a Republican, but I don’t believe that this bad thing they are doing is right, or that bad thing they are doing is right.” If you say you are a Republican and you ever vote for a Republican, YOU ARE SUPPORTING THEIR AGENDA, WHETHER YOU WANT TO OR NOT. YOU ARE A COLLABORATOR!!!
It’s time to TAKE SIDES. It is down to “US” and “THEM.” I believe that Republicans are “THEM” and everybody else (not specifically Democrats, btw) are “US.”
Apologists and collaborators are going to have to remember that old saying from the 1960’s — “If you are not part of the solution, you are part of the problem.” No more just driving around in your nice car and filling up with gas and paying your taxes and thinking “it’s not my problem.”
We are as close to fascism in this country as we have ever been.
The Days of Decision are coming.
We are frogs begin slow-cooked, and by the time we realize the water is boiling, we won’t have the strength to jump out of the pot. Perhaps we already don’t.
Charlie L
Portland, Oregon
[email protected]
Republicans lie and innocent people die.
Republicans steal and give to their rich friends, leaving just an IOU for our kids to pay off.
Republicans cheat and think they are “moral.”
We must flush away all Republicans in ’06 and ’08.
I have been reading on the blog about the national ID cards & it infuriates me. I honestly cannot believe what this country has become in the last 5 years!
Recently, there was a spot on the news about a bill in Florida allowing people to use guns & this law actually protects them. I can’t remember a lot of the details, but you should look it up. I just know I’ll be staying away from Florida for awhile. It’s frightening. I’m beginning to wonder why we’re over in Iraq @ all…perhaps we’re taking lessons from their old regime?
Kindest regards,
Mandee
“Do they think we’re idiots?”
Yes, in fact, everyone of wealth and power does think the masses are mere sheep to be led along to the slaughter. I am a very, stress, very conservative person, but noone, Democrat or Republican, has the right to alter our Constitution. Whether it is the basic right to life that was destroyed by RoevWade or by this bill. Those in power, both Democrat and Republican, have all been chipping away at our rights for a hundred and forty years, beginning with the Civil War. The sheep were led to believe that slavery was what started that war, but it was over the right of the state to make it’s own laws to govern itself. Abraham Lincoln, who is touted to have freed the slaves, said during the Civil War, that if he could stop the war without freeing a single slave, he would. (side note: slavery is wrong, and I am in no way endorsing or condoning it. It is morally reprehensible to think one human should be able to own another, so save the comments, please) Soon after at the turn of the twentieth century an ammendment was illegally passed allowing for an income tax. (Illegally because our beloved income tax was never properly ratified by the required 3/4 majority necessary to make an ammendment to the constitution; even your books the IRS gives you refer to it as a voluntary tax. Voluntary as long as you pay, if not they arrest and seize, before trial in many cases.) After the stock market crash of 1929, Joseph Kennedy pushed legislation disallowing “the masses” to make certain “risky” investments. Did you know it is illegal for the average man to even be told about, because his net worth is under $1million?(not to mention a required minimum annual income)
Even though Wil and I disagree on a lot of thinks fundamentally, I’m with him on this, I say lets spend some time organizing a nationwide strike, and shut down the government. Peaceful, of course, no inciting to riot here!
“Do they think we’re idiots?”
Yes, in fact, everyone of wealth and power does think the masses are mere sheep to be led along to the slaughter. I am a very, stress, very conservative person, but noone, Democrat or Republican, has the right to alter our Constitution. Whether it is the basic right to life that was destroyed by RoevWade or by this bill. Those in power, both Democrat and Republican, have all been chipping away at our rights for a hundred and forty years, beginning with the Civil War. The sheep were led to believe that slavery was what started that war, but it was over the right of the state to make it’s own laws to govern itself. Abraham Lincoln, who is touted to have freed the slaves, said during the Civil War, that if he could stop the war without freeing a single slave, he would. (side note: slavery is wrong, and I am in no way endorsing or condoning it. It is morally reprehensible to think one human should be able to own another, so save the comments, please) Soon after at the turn of the twentieth century an ammendment was illegally passed allowing for an income tax. (Illegally because our beloved income tax was never properly ratified by the required 3/4 majority necessary to make an ammendment to the constitution; even your books the IRS gives you refer to it as a voluntary tax. Voluntary as long as you pay, if not they arrest and seize, before trial in many cases.) After the stock market crash of 1929, Joseph Kennedy pushed legislation disallowing “the masses” to make certain “risky” investments. Did you know it is illegal for the average man to even be told about, because his net worth is under $1million?(not to mention a required minimum annual income)
Even though Wil and I disagree on a lot of thinks fundamentally, I’m with him on this, I say lets spend some time organizing a nationwide strike, and shut down the government. Peaceful, of course, no inciting to riot here!
Cyberchas, I agree with Crouton in one sense. Crouton means that he/she has a fundamental belief that certain things within the democratic party are morally wrong, and could not in good concience, support them. Our only option, unfortunately, is to vote our concience, as I am sure you do. America isn’t about everyone agreeing, that would be closer to Communism. Had my senator said, “Hey, I think I’ll rip up the Constitution and throw it in your face.” I would have voted differently. Keep in mind, back in the 1980’s, it was Ronald Reagan, a Republican, who kept asking a Democratically held House and Senate for the line item veto to prevent such things as this. They knew he’d cut their pork barrel spending and reign in the deficit, so they would not give it to him. Unfortunately, the republicans responded in kind when Clinton wanted the same thing. As voters, we must demand change, but pointing fingers at people who agree with you on this issue and declaring them to be collaborators in kind with Nazis, sheesh, the first thing the Nazis did was legalize abortion and euthanasia… who should we consider the Nazis?
Just wait until all the religous folks out there decide to label this the ‘mark of the beast’ and start preparing for the end of the world.
Hey, now, any good reason to stock up on supplies and bring down fear upon the masses is a good one. In fact, this may all be a plot by Wal-Mart to increase sales. Instill mass hysteria and force us to buy food, flashlights and bottled water… they could make billions…lol
I think people who believe THAT strongly on either side of the fence should just challenge each other to a duel and be done with it. Chas is no better than his Extreme-Right counterparts: You cannot, simply CANNOT, have a civilized debate when you’re the only one being civilized.
Hate speech is hate speech to matter what group you’re making generalizations about.
As a test, Chas (and everyone), what if you take his tagline:
“Republicans lie and innocent people die.
Republicans steal and give to their rich friends, leaving just an IOU for our kids to pay off.
Republicans cheat and think they are “moral.”
We must flush away all Republicans in ’06 and ’08.”
…and replace “Republican” with “Jew”…
…or “Nigger.”
I have no doubt he spewed the word “Republican” out with all the bile and vitriol usually accompanying the vile names I also listed.
I’m deeply against the ID card.
I’m more against bigoted bastards that wrap themselves in the flag like it’s a magical cloak of protection (+3 against the slings and arrows of criticism.)
How about instead of debating each other when we all essetially are saying the same thing (Real ID is of the bad) and use that fire and brimstone to let our governmental reps know how we feel?
Although since the average political candidate has more corporate sponsors than a NASCAR driver, not sure how much good it’ll do.
Republicans brought this on us. Why not point out the obvious and use the same type or rhetoric on them they use on the rest of us and our rights?
well, America was a nice experiment while it lasted. It took unpatriotic bigots only six years to tear it down under the leadership of George W. Bush.
Spacewriter…
How many Republicans are in the Senate? How many Senators voted to pass this?
Republicans brought this on us? They may have come up with the idea, but it looks like the Dems had just as much to do with it getting passed.
Amen, Thomas.
CyberChas is obviously as much of the problem as those in power now and is representative of the type of left-wing radicals with whom he no doubt keeps company.
Republicans are not the problem. Radicals are the problem, on either side of the dividing line, left or right. And the problem, as I see it, GeminiLove, is that talking to our representatives is talking to radicals. It’s useless. Voting them out of office is better. Your intention is not lost on me, though, but I admit to being extremely jaded.
Further, I’d like to say that the people in power now are not republicans. GW is so far right, he’s giving republicans a bad name, lol. He’s blurred the line between extreme right and extreme left. He’s grown government, spent loads of money, and put government more and more in the people’s lives. This is not republicanism. Come on.
This country is as divided as it ever has been. I know, though, in my heart of hearts that things happen for a reason and truth always prevails. Maybe it has to get worse before more people can wake up and see things with new, fresh eyes.
I hear the south of France is nice this time of year…
Open sesame!
AB
Marco beat me too it, but I was going to say that a bill passing 100-0 ( I think that’s the tally previously mentioned) means it wasn’t just the Republicans passing the bill…
Wil,
There’s an old saying that goes ‘you don’t get the government you want – you get the government you deserve.’ This is what our collective apathy and willingness to be led by big business has gotten us.
I’m disgusted at how our system works. I’m outraged by the Real ID and all the baggage it brought with it. Am I surprised?
Not one bit.
Face it, if we want America back, we need to TAKE it back, but that would mean missing an episode or two of American Idol, and we just can’t have that.
Remember this, America – we have the government we deserve.
In defense of the guy up above who says he is a Republican, but does not agree with the current administration’s agenda (Crouton):
It’s a completely understandable position. I, myself, am an independednt who hangs out a little to the far left (lest anyone aim their guns at me). While being willing to stand, even in name with the current manifestation of the Republican Party *is* tacit approval of their actions, it does not discredit the statement that one can be a Republican and not agree with any of this. Because, fact is, ALL of this nonsense is very much against the core principles on which the Republican ideology is based. They are calling themselves Republicans, but they are not acting as such. Perhaps the definition of Republican is changing, but it had traditionally been Republican=conservative=belief in *small* government, as opposed to Democrat=liberal=belief in somewhat larger government (more social programs).
So, yes, you are perhaps a truer Republican than they, but they control Congress now, don’t they?
Crouton, you may hit a point where you may have to make a moral judgement to leave a political party founded on principles that you believe in, because it is no longer governed by those principles. Good luck with that. (sincerely)
I don’t like conforming to any one political party. Not only do I not agree with any of them, but I think that choosing sides just goes further to divide us as a nation. Now, I’m a Christian and probably the only uber-conservative here considering my age, but this whole crap with the REAL ID is freaking nuts man! It’s going to eventually get so bad that we can’t take a leak in our own bathroom.
This kinda crap makes me sad for our country and how it’s gone downhill so fast from what it was around 100 or even 50 years ago.
Wil, I understand your scorn for this Bill; however, why don’t you hold the democrats accountable for their votes in the Senate? If I am not mistaken, the bill passed 100-0.
Is it just evil republicans at work, or are our elected officials just doing what they think their constituents want?
Philibuster!!!!!
The Dems have philibustered ever judicial appointment for six years, and they can’t do it for this? I hate the philibuster, because it is so overused, but this is the type of thing it was designed to prevent. The Dems could have threatened a philibuster to have the extra baggage removed, and the media attention from CNN would have brought this out in a national debate and made the dems heroes. As a ultra-conservative, Ted Kennedy being a hero is a bit unnerving, however, I could have lived with it.
Wil said, “As a postscript, the icing on the cake of this whole thing has to be the way that the Republican sponsors of the bill actually voted down a proposed provision in the national ID card part of the law that would prevent the government from using the Real ID database as a national database of gun owners
Of course. Why am I not surprised? The Republicans in Congress don’t care at all about upholding the Constitution. They have abandoned their traditional belief in limited, non-intrusive government. They are the collective bitch of the Extreme Religious Right and groups like the NRA. They are tyrants, and Democrats who allowed this to pass without discussion or debate are cowards.”
Now first, I want to make clear I don’t disagree on this issue. I do think that both the way this went through and what it does are wrong. Having said that, I disagree with your over-the-top characterization of Republicans (I’m not a Republican either.) Specifically here you say they are the “bitch” of the NRA, yet they VOTED DOWN a provision that would have PREVENTED the use of this new ID database as a gun registry – something the NRA would be AGAINST. In other words, the leadership did something their base (including me) is gonna hate. So reign it in there a bit Wil. Not all us right-wingers are unreasonable. Your not-very-veiled attempt in your previous post on the topic to paint Sensenbrenner as a Nazi (“Herr Sensenbrenner”) was clumsy and inappropriate also. I work for a German-based corporation and that comes across badly to me, especially given that modern Germany is more aligned with you politically than with these “fascist” Republicans.
We’ve really gotten off of Wil’s final thoughts, me included, which was to stage a general strike. What does everyone think of that, since everyone agrees the National ID card is a bad thing?
The Republican party’s approach to issues like this isn’t being driven by gun owners or hill billies or, really, by Bible-bangers either. It is a frightening facet of mainstream America that believes that the government can and should have these powers to fight the terrorist boogieman.
It’s being driven by people like The Rich Asshole Neighbor (TM) and soccer moms who have been whipped into a near panic about terrorism and “Homeland Security” (as opposed to all the other “lands” where we are concerned about security – I guess the government isn’t concerned about Hawaii, Guam, Samoa, or the Virgin Islands…but I digress), and are willing to go along with anything that gives the government some ability – real or perceived – to combat this supposed threat. These people don’t care about politics, they just want the government to “deal with it” while they worry about their own private lives, complacently assuming that the government is benign and benevolent.
This stuff is bad news, folks. I “used to be” a Republican too, and while I have never been a hardcore anything, I can honestly say now that I am closer to the Democrats overall.
DaveESQ, I’m afraid you have it wrong. It’s not the soccer moms and frightened neighbors pushing these initiatives. It is the neo-con Republican machine (in concert with the MSM) pushing these initiatives and USING FEAR to get them through.
Read the documents of the Project for a New American Century (http://www.newamericancentury.org/). They specifically said that it would take “some kind of modern Pearl Harbour” to give them the leeway to implement their agenda. With 9/11 they got that event. Many conspiracy theorists would maintain that the Administration would even have allowed 9/11 to happen (or aided) in order to have their “motivating moment” so that their agenda could be implemented.
As for the German who objects to the references to Nazi’s — too bad. That is history, and it is, unfortunately, being re-lived here in the USA. I was amazed as I read the timeline of Hitler’s rise to power how QUICKLY things started to happen when they happened. Who was going to take the risk seriously in 1928 when his party got only 3% of the vote; and yet by January of 1933 when he was made Chancellor it was probably too late to stop him. Three months later Dachau concentration camp was established.
If you put a bunch of frogs into a pot of boiling water they will immediately jump out. If you put them into a pot of mildly warm water they will sit quietly (perhaps, watching AMERICAN IDOL). If you then slowly heat up the water, they will relax languidly (perhaps following the trials and tribulations of Michael Jackson and the Runaway Bride). By the time the water is boiling and they are moments from dying, their strength will be sapped and they will be unable to jump from the pot.
The Days of Decision are coming.
We are frogs begin slow-cooked, and by the time we realize the water is
boiling, we won’t have the strength to jump out of the pot. Perhaps we
already don’t.
Charlie L
Portland, Oregon
[email protected]
Republicans lie and innocent people die.
Republicans steal and give to their rich friends, leaving just an IOU for
our kids to pay off.
Republicans cheat and think they are “moral.”
We must flush away all Republicans in ’06 and ’08.
P.S. I completely agree that a GENERAL STRIKE is a good idea, but don’t know how you would get people to do it. You would need to get the MSM to promote it, and they won’t. And you would probably need a “catalyzing event” to force it, and that won’t be publicized either. If Americans aren’t able to be informed about the theft of a Presidential election (perhaps the most awesome political criminal enterprise in history) then what event could possibly motivate them to “go to the streets” for their Democracy.
Charlie L-
I’m not really interested in a protracted debate on a blog comment thread, but suffice it to say that I’ve been hearing shocking things about giving government more power coming out of the mouths of Rich Asshole Neighbors (TM) and soccer moms continuously since 9/11/01. Before any political machine got its story straight. People who won’t think things through in a balanced way often react in this extreme way to a serious threat, and have for all of humanity.
Also – if this is a neo-conservative agenda without broader support (or at least broader apathy by the parties I’ve mentioned), then why are the Democrats apparently just rolling over? If this is a lunatic fringe idea, how does it get glossed over 100-0? What, or who, are they afraid of if they oppose this measure? Probably the otherwise liberal soccer mom and New England/SoCAL/NY Rich Asshole Neighbor votes.
As far as conspiracy theories and activist journalist websites like New American Century – I pretty much don’t listen to them at all. I also don’t take as gospel any media source’s “report” or “analysis” of a bill or law, since the people writing and editing the articles simply aren’t qualified to evaluate the REAL effects and implications of these things. I cannot tell you how many times I have laughed out loud at some liberal rag’s chicken little analysis, or thrown something at my TV because Bill O’Reilly has gotten the law so wrong, yet stated it so pompously. The media consistently presents the law or a proposed law in a manner that suits their tag lines, rather than for what it actually is.
In other words – no, I don’t have it wrong.
I can’t believe news sources are reporting on the RealID part of it and not the constitutional issues. Another thing that has me concerned is that the same rider tactic will be used to extend pieces of the Patriot Act.
A correction to the ArsTechnica artilce, the bill is acutally HR 1268 not HR 418. HR 418 was the original RealID bill and HR 1268 is the appropriations bill. After reading it it seems all of HR 418 was included in the apporpriations bill but the wording on the “NO JUDICAL REVIEW” section has been altered a bit. I wish they had covered the bill that passed and not it’s failed predecesor.
The suggestion that the Republican Legislators leading the way amidst the current trends towards less personal freedom, less open government, more governmental intrusion into people’s lives – and by extension the entire Republican leadership – think we’re all idiots is surely true at some level. There are people out there who consider “us” – meaning not them – as idiots collectively, and those who simply don’t think of us as one thing or another because we’re outside of their collective consciousness.
More alarmingly, there is an entire generation of political thinkers both in strategy and policy, elected and appointed, who are not thinking of the long term health of our country, but who only know how to craft either plan or policy in a short-sighted situational way.
I think of them as the “MBA Politicos”, not because I think of people with those degrees as evil, but because we’ve had a certain bit of practical demonstration thanks to Worldcom and Enron and Haliburton, to name a few, of how short-sighted and selfish many thinkers in the current business degree crop can be, and the political effects of that kind of thinking is certainly going to be as devestating politically as the corporate ones were economically, and what we’re seeing in the political sphere is srprisingly similar to the blind one-sided optimism we saw cause those corporate scandals.
Fortunately, we’ve still got opportunities to slow down or stop this MBA armageddon. Not all the people who currently support the Republican extremists in office are all that convinced of the rightness of their position, and when push comes to shove, many are just not going to be able to do what amounts to betrayal of the centuries of leadership and integrity that have come before them. All they need is a little courage, and that is something we can give them I think.
If I may interject for a moment. Will, you indicated “Okay, prohibiting judicial review of anything is absolutely insane. Without judicial review of laws, how to we have a balanced government? How do we protect our constitutional rights when unconstitutional laws are passed? How do we prevent the tyranny of the majority? Does this mean that the United States ceases to be a nation of laws, and becomes a nation of men?”
Indeed, it may seem that the prohibition of judicial review is insane; however, Article III, Section 2, Clause 2 of the Constitution provides, “the supreme Court shall have appellate Jurisdiction, both as to Law and Fact, with such Exceptions, and under such Regulations as the Congress shall make.”
Indeed, Congress does have the authority, granted to them by our founding fathers, to withhold Law from the review of the Supreme Court.
You know, it’s funny. I have to say that after reading the comments here, I’m glad we have the people in government we have now. I’d much rather have them than you crazy bastards! 🙂
AB
I find the REAL ID bill pretty frightening (we might be getting something similar in the UK shortly). I’ve been trying to follow this from the UK but it really does mystify me how this is going to become law. I read that it was “must pass” because, as well as the funds for the military in Iraq, it also included increases in payments to the families of military personnel who had been killed. Who was it who lumped all this stuff together into one bill?
One other point: have the Republicans denounced “small government” or something? They seem to be spending a hell of a lot of money.
BTW, I’d probably be described as a liberal in the US.
If I may point out one thing: The concept of “judicial review” (i.e. declaring laws unconstitutional) appears nowhere in the U.S. Constitution. It was established by the Supreme Court in the famous Marbury v. Madison case. On the other hand, as John D. Schultz points out, the Congress explicitly has the power to set the jurisdiction of Federal courts, up to and including the Supreme Court.
That said…I looked at the bill text (on Thomas) and the section of the U.S. Code it amends, and it appears that this concerns only a series of improvements to be made along the border near San Diego. The original of that section provided for a waiver of the Endangered Species Act and the National Environmental Policy Act to the extent required to construct this. (And that part was passed in 1996.) I’m guessing somebody found another way to throw a monkey wrench into the construction process, which the provision in the current bill was designed to circumvent. Obviously, this issue has gotten a lot more critical in recent years, and we badly need that border shored up; we shouldn’t have to subordinate the defense of the United States to a bunch of radical environmentalists and NIMBYs. But to interpret this strictly limited grant of waiver as an imminent collapse of rule of law in the United States is wildly alarmist at best.
I’m still not fond of the REAL ID act as a whole, nor of the way it was slotted into the military appropriations bill. There are better things that could be done to curb illegal immigration, but I wonder if the Republicans, including the Administration, have the balls to actually deal with this issue in an appropriate manner.
I just went through the Public Print of the legislation (it’s final version), and it appears that the entire Real ID section has been struck out. Forgive my ignorance, but would that mean that it was eliminated?
(link to text of legislation)
http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/D?c109:5:./temp/~c109IKMhiR::
“They are tyrants, and Democrats who allowed this to pass without discussion or debate are cowards.” This is only the beginning, my friend. All it takes is the right (or is that wrong?) president to tip the scales, and our government will cease to be a “democracy,” in both name and practice. I forsee this occuring not within my lifetime (if I’m lucky), but most certainly sometime in the next century. It has happened before, after all – just look at Rome…
Naiah:
It’s there, just not exactly where you were looking. It is H.R.1268, 109th Session of Congress, and down towards the bottom of the text is Title VII, Additional General Provisions, Division B: Real ID Act of 2005. It has three separate Titles of its own, and 19 Sections. The URL I get is http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/
D?c109:11:./temp/~c109AzPZlV::, but that is a temporary link and I think people looking will just have to go to Thomas and search for themselves.
Of note is the following under “Major Congressional Actions”:
5/10/2005 Conference report agreed to in Senate: Senate agreed to conference report by Yea-Nay Vote. 100 – 0. Record Vote Number: 117.
5/10/2005 Cleared for White House.
The more I learn about this, and the faster the juggernaut behind this picks up speed, the more frightened I become.
“When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the American flag.”
Indeed! Why should we think that the form fascism will take here will be a clone of what took hold in 1930s Italy? It will be a different iteration of the same phenomenon. But that makes it more frightening, because it is harder to attack and executed with more cunning.
Congress can limit the jurisdiction of federal courts but probably not of state courts, so if the realID bill is unconstitutional (I’m not sure that it is), file suit in your local courthouse.
A general strike would be cool though.
What the hell does the NRA have to do with the RealID bill? NOTHING. Wil, are really you so into insulting anyone who does not share your exact political beliefs that you ignore the facts of the topic at hand?
I am a member of the NRA. Every member I know is against this bill. In case you had not noticed, we are the “pro-personal freedoms” people. We are the people who want the very least amount of government possible. We are the tin foil hat brigade, armed. Be against our cause for any number of other reasons you may have, but don’t tie us to this shit!
Wil, I did not think you were that stupid. I mean, is it stupidity or do you have to lash out at any general group you dislike over any unrelated issue? Seriously, why not just claim that the Mormons or the Jews or the ACLU is for RealID? I am so against RealID you cannot even believe it. Your highlighting of the issue had me right up until the last paragraph. Are you this thoughtless in real life?
For a similar thread check here on a post about torture. It argues that we must absolutely uphold the Law against torture, even while acknowledging that at some points someone may have to risk life in prison to extract information from a prisoner (in the limit case of a dirty bomb).
When Gonzales calls the Geneva Conventions “quaint”, then the Exception (torture) to the Law becomes part of the Law itself, contaminating it. Law ceases to be Law, and we do once again become men, barbarian.
Regardless of who’s to blame, or who SHOULD be blamed…
…the prospect is frightening to the very core.
I hope that those of us with brain matter will stand up for the whole ‘lot’ of us and speak out against this madness…before it goes way too far (like it hasn’t already) :p
I have been sitting here giving a great deal of thought to what your wrote, and i think what we need is a person WHO HAS BALLS AND NO FEAR to tell everyone in washington what they think someone who has a independent mind and someone who is not a sell out.
I have seen more misery then good and the assclowns in washington forget it is US THEY WORK FOR AND NOT THERE OWN INTREST.
This mean demorcrats and republicans alike it is time for new blood and fresh ideas, THE “W” has turned this once great country of ours the a shadow of it’s former glory.
gore or kerry wasnt the answer but they would have been a better choice.
What we need is someone who is NOT LINK TO ANY RELIGOUS GROUPS AND WAS NOT HANDED THE SILVER SPOON.
we need someone who has seen the worse this country has to offer and knows what to do to make it right and then we can worry about the worlds problems after.
sorry i didnt mean to vent but it had to said
thank you
If you put a bunch of frogs into a pot of boiling water they will immediately jump out. If you put them into a pot of mildly warm water they will sit quietly…If you then slowly heat up the water, they will relax languidly…By the time the water is boiling and they are moments from dying, their strength will be sapped and they will be unable to jump from the pot.
Um…wrong.
Just for the record.