379 thoughts on “Tabletop, Kingdom Builder, and Screwing Up the Rules”

1. “Tabletop is where millions of people from all over the world go to see how games are played”

   “How games are played”? You mean like getting all the way through the game, possibly even multiple times, before realizing you got the rules horribly wrong? Mission accomplished!

   I remember how excited my group was the first time we beat Arkham Horror, only to realize after the fact that we’d handled blessings, a key component to our victory, in entirely the wrong way.

   And I can’t remember exactly how many times I’ve been leafing through the rules in the middle of a game only to stop and go “wait, we’ve been doing this all wrong the whole time!” and then spend time arguing what to do about it, because it’s happened way too often!

2. I’m torn by this – first, I love the show and up to now had never considered goofs in the rules as any big deal. I have always judged the show on the entertainment value first, the gameplay second, and the quality of the game and show production last.

   (One point of clarification, for me, entertainment value includes being able to hear and see what is going on – which some might lump into production).

   But after reading this, and reading the responses so far, I had to rethink part of it. There IS a business angle here – at least insofar as people donated money to make it happen, so in some sense there is accountability. I don’t think that accountability is truly defined – beyond what Wil himself feels it should be, and perhaps what he has gotten from backers in terms of feedback for three seasons.

   And, there is an obligation, even if self-imposed, to the game designers and publishers of those games the show demonstrates to treat the games fairly and avoid showing them in a negative light.

   So, in a sense, there is some pressure to deliver the show with a level of quality – at the very least for the games themselves and the hobby, and for the backers. I had never considered this, and I am sure a lot of people who review games on YouTube have never considered this – or simply don’t care.

   Wil, at least, cares. He shows that in his constant enthusiasm for the hobby, his social media comments, and even in this post.

   This post is probably misguided – and probably written in anger and frustration because of the pressures I mentioned above. And because Wil is clearly, like many of us who are geeks, nerds or gaming enthusiasts, fairly anal about being accurate about most of what we attempt to do or say. We care enough to take the time. It is irritating, to say the least, when someone else you trust does not – especially when it is consistent.

   I say probably misguided because I don’t know all the behind the scenes facts. From what I know – which is what I read in the post by Wil alone – I can’t agree with his approach. I am the Executive Vice President of a software company, with one part of my responsibility customer service and support. I take flak often from customers demanding someone’s head for issues, whether real or imagined. I don’t agree with blaming anyone on my team, even if it is clearly a mistake made by them or even if it was a purposeful negligent act. The responsibility is mine, in front of the customers and in private. I interviewed, approved hiring, review performance, managed training and process improvement, etc. When things happen, I will have my discussion with that individual privately, and document it, and take appropriate action – and it will be done without public fanfare.

   Wil’s blog shows his passion, and I appreciate that. It shows honesty, and that is also commendable. I hope it shows continued commitment, which I believe it does. For selfish reasons, these things should mean we get more seasons of TT.

   But I do agree with those who say no blame should be assigned beyond saying it happened, it shouldn’t have and it will be corrected moving forward. I don’t think anyone – even game designers and publishers – would expect more or lose any respect for this great boardgaming vehicle had that been the approach.

   1. Agreed. This post is a very poor demonstration of management. That’s what G&S and Wil are in this situation….management. Don’t throw your employees under the bus. Fix it. Help them improve their performance or remove them. This is a business and serious money and jobs are involved. Wil owes an apology to his team. I don’t think he owes it to the viewers. A vent post like this is poor form.

3. Woow. How can you blame it on someone else? The money made you lazy and you made a bad work. You should read the rules to this light games and play them at lest 10 times before doing a video. Do the right thing admit you are responsible alone and redo and do it right!!!

4. Seems like you’re starting to take it too seriously, Wil. If it’s negatively affecting your life to the extent that you feel the need to post this kind of vitriol, perhaps you should walk away from it for a while.

5. In business you must be able to trust people to do their job, and they are permitted to screw up as long as they don’t repeat mistakes or fail to execute their required core competency exceptionally. Getting the right people on the team falls to the owner of the bus. So a simple note about bringing a new team member on to help make this right moving forward would have been positive and sufficient. Read Good to Great by Jim Collins for more on building a great team. I am not affiliated.

6. I am a big fan of Tabletop, and you, Wil. I haven’t seen the episode in question yet, but as a Season Three backer, I have gotten my money’s worth and more, from the work you do. You show people having fun. Yes, rules are a thing, but they are not the only thing, and I believe the game is the thing, and the playing of the game. You have shown games that I am all about getting and some that I will never play, but it’s all good because it’s all the game. Good work Wil.

7. Do not put the blame on someone else, you are in charge and so it is all your fault if something goes bad.
   You should definitely not put blame on someone else online. Sham on you, do better in the future!

   1. This is true, the buck stops with him.
      At the same time, as someone who has managed other people, and had to be in charge of largish stuff, things can and do fall through the cracks for whoever is in charge, and that is why people exist to make sure those things work.

   2. Sham(e) on you for Peter Rogneholt for not reading the post.

      Wil is placing the blame on himself but explaining how these mistakes came about and how much it has pained him. I hope the producer in question learns from this, just as I hope Wil has learned from it too. Mistakes are a great teaching instrument. Being in charge is about ultimately taking the blame but that doesn’t give everyone else a pass

      Thank you Wil, Felcia, all the Geek & Sundry team members, and special guests for Tabletop. I enjoy the show and hope to see many more episodes in the future.

      1. No, spending most of the post blaming someone else and then one sentence saying that you’re in charge and ultimately responsible is the exact opposite of taking responsibility, and it’s pretty reprehensible behavior.

         Not only that, but all of this language he used in this post is directed at a specific person. He might as well have said these things directly to that person’s face, which makes him a fairly disgusting human being to talk to anyone that way. He’s the guy in the restaurant who starts screaming at the waiter when his order is wrong. This blog entry is reprehensible.

         1. Your analogy makes no sense. Wil is the waiter getting screamed at for delivering the wrong order, and it is the person in the kitchen who made it wrong, but it is a responsibility they both share — the cook for getting it right to begin with and the waiter for checking that it was right before delivering. There is the analogy you are looking for.

            And now that we have an accurate analogy lets take a look at where the first failure in the situation happens, with the person making the food. They have one job, cook the food to order. That failed in this case (that it was not the first time is not particularly relevant to this side of the conversation, but impactful regarding Wil’s feeling the need to explain). Now the final responsibility lies with the waiter, they are the last check before it is presented, as such they bear final responsibility…but final responsibility versus primary responsibility, it is obvious that the ultimate failure is on the cook. The waiter in a restaurant will apologize (as Wil did), explin what the issue is (as Wil did), and seek to make corrections (as he has said that he would).

            Now Wil could have simply said, “Look, the rules got screwed up, this isn’t the first time this season, and it won’t be the last. I am truly sorry.” But you know wht, that isn’t enough. Backers want to know how and why these mistakes happened, and as backers they have the right to know. Protecting the individual to the extent of not explaining does no one any favors. Not outing the specific person’s name but being very clear that he or she had in the past done very good work, and that he (Wil) should have double checked are all stand up things. No one knows which producer was responsible for the rules, but we know the matter has been addressed, that Wil takes the problem incredibly seriously, and that he has apologized for the mistakes because he understands that no matter how much trust he puts in others, it is his name that is associated with this project, he is it’s face and it reflects on him professionally, he must double check, something he had done in the past but did not do this time.

            And here you are, along with others heaping more scorn on him and holding him to a standard I’m willing you don’t hold your waiter at your favorite restaurant. That is simply unfair.

      2. Wil is blaming the other chap for the best part of the article, with a nod to “the buck stopping here” about half way down.

         As much as I respect and like Wil, it was an unseemly attack on someone whose side of the story we will possibly never get to know.

         Assuming that the producer was negligent in his duties for season 3, it still looks like Wil is passing off the blame on to someone else.
         IMHO it was ill judged. A simple apology would have sufficed and people would have felt more kindly disposed towards him on the matter.

   3. Clearly you have never worked on any kind of project like this. Big projects like this require you to rely and trust other people, and sometimes those people screw up! Yes Wil is in charge, but it doesn’t mean its his fault.

      Shame on you!

   4. I completely disagree. You did exactly the right thing, Mr Wheaton.

8. My husband and I are huge fans of Tabletop and your wonderful self! We play games together almost every night and we’ve purchased about a half dozen new ones because of your show. We watch for the entertainment value, the exposure to new games we might otherwise miss, and because it’s nice to feel connected to other people through the enjoyment of game play. I hate that you’re getting such negative comments from people – yes, the rules got messed up a few times but hey, my husband and I used to somehow switch our game pieces with each other playing Monopoly. Every. Single. Time. And not notice until at least 20 turns later. What you’re doing is great, and I hope you keep sharing your love for games with us!!!

9. You did mess up the rules, but Will, that is okay. It happens. It is unfortunate, for sure, but it happens. Personally, I find it funny when you mess up the rules, and as long as there is the owlbear there to point it out, I think that no harm is really done. That being said, I really do hope that you go on to produce more tabletop, as it is always a delight to watch, and it has been a great way for me to pick what board games to purchase for myself as i go off to college.
   Best Regards and DFTBA,
   Jordan Davis

10. Well, at the end of the day, the show is fun to watch. The guests are great, the games are great, and I must say–the mistake owlbear is nice as well. I think people are a little salty in this comment section, as they so often are in comment sections. Anyway, thank you will, I love the show, and I don’t think you should stop. Screw the haters, DFTBA

11. I understand that the absolute rules are important, however i have always enjoyed tabletop for it’s entertainment value above all else. it is also a great showcase for games that people maybe haven’t heard of before. as such, I feel minor rule mistakes can be overlooked as long as the key aspects of the game are properly represented…

    Also, in response to comments claiming it is unfair to blame someone else for these mistakes, i think it is important to identify the cause of the mistakes, assure people who watch the show that steps are being taken to resolve that cause and apologise for the errors. i believe that is what Mr Wheaton did. it would have been worse to simply say “sorry about that guys, no idea how that happened.”

    finally, as far as apologising to games developers for potentially hurting the sales of their games, me and my friends are having a game day next week playing almost exclusively games that we had never heard of before seeing them showcased on tabletop, and I am sure we are not the only ones purchasing games because of their inclusion in the show.

    regards.

    (p.s when playing “Betrayal at house on the hill”, never roll the dark dice, it’s just a terrible idea, you get eaten by werewolves…)

12. Haven’t watched season three yet. I tend to binge. No one gets all the rules right on a game more complicated than candy land. If you are having fun as a group and passing that sense of fun on to your audience you are capturing the core aspect of “game” and thus serving the greater gaming audience. To the dude who posted above, he said it was his fault but that the cause was someone’s specific action. Without naming that person. Chill, that is walking g the appropriate line of transparency and acknowledgement of problems. Chill.

13. its a game, Wil…just a game..theres worse things in the world than messing up some rules.
    cant wait for season 4.

14. Own the fact that you messed up the rules. Every true gamer has played many games for the first time messsing up the rules.This happens and makes the second game that much stronger. Admit this happens to all of us gamers. Gamers and your fans are a forgiving sort. I think that when others ask you to take the blame they are not being vindictive just corrective with support for you and your show. Try playing the game for us a second time showing comparing your incorrect rules to the correct rules and this is how most of us gamers role.

    1. From a true fan boy.

15. Wil, the hard part about your job is that any mistakes are hugely public ones that stay in the public eye forever. I couldn’t imagine dealing with that. Just remember that you’re not perfect, ad you’ll run yourself ragged if you insist that you should have known EVERYTHING, a manager who double-checks everyones’ work is a micro-manager, give yourself a pat on the back for the 99% of “things that could go wrong” but DIDN’T because you WERE on top of it, and remember that everyone who doesn’t understand that doesn’t get a vote!

    AND, the next time you need someone to stay on top of the rules for you, CALL ME. That’s my job in my games group. I won’t say I’m a Munchkin; If we have house rules that we agree to as more fun, I’ll fully support it. But I am the final judge when someone asks, “Can he really do that?” (Me, and my little cheat sheets that I make up for each game)

    Hugs, my fellow board-game aficionado!

    Esther from Canada

16. Indeed this episode is inferior, but that’s because of a very arid and low-story game… That said, you are right, these were big mistakes. You should perhaps correct them in post-production, and not do them again next time… But, hey, you’re still doing great ! Fire that guy, though.

17. I have a complaint, that your episodes have created a false impression. When I am at home, and playing this game I expect to be provided 3-4 interesting witty adults of varied backgrounds and at least two owlbear comments per game. Until I am provided this I will hold my breath.

18. Rules mistakes happen; earlier this year I went out and got Pandemic because of watching it on Tabletop and one of the group said “yeah I played that before, it was fun”. And then we proceeded to butcher the rules severely by missing one detail which made it much easier.

    I felt bad after checking it, and the other players shrugged and said it was then a practice run instead of a “real” game. We’d play it again someday and do it right. But we all had fun.

    In the end, having a fun time, being entertained, is what these games exist for. I can think of no better thing than for a game, even played improperly, to bring satisfaction and entertainment. This is why I have a more . . . casual . . . relationship with Magic: the Gathering anymore.

19. I actually thought you did it really well until I looked at the comments…

20. Ugh. What a self-centered, CYA response. But an appropriate cap to a mediocre season. I was a backer for this season but I already decided before this that I wouldn’t back another. This just seals it.

21. To Wil and Boyan both:
    thank you for doing your best to convey the right rules on various episodes of TableTop. I appreciate it.
    I’ve made exact the same rules mistake in my first couple of home games of Kingdom Builder a couple of years ago (but I re-read the rules after a few plays), so I’m glad that the episode took a moment (via the owlbear) to set the record straight.

    Please don’t be mad at each other. 1<3

22. You can’t blame someone and then claim to take responsibility. That’s not exactly how taking responsibility works.

    1. Darn right!

    2. Actually that’s how it really does work. Leaders claim responsibility for errors their subordinates make.

       Wil has identified that he is responsible for this producers mistakes. He apologized repeatedly his role as the leader in this situation.

       1. “Actually that’s how it really does work.”

          Nope.

          “Leaders claim responsibility for errors their subordinates make.”

          Yes, absolutely. That’s the entire point. Wil said he was claiming responsibility, but this came only after several paragraphs of pointing at someone else as being responsible, which is exactly the opposite of claiming responsibility.

          That said, Wil’s made a followup post now doing a much better job of this, so that’s that.

          1. You misunderstand how this works. I have a subordinate who does a thing incorrectly. No one catches it. It is their fault. They had a job and failed to do that aspect of it correctly. IT can be no one else’s fault. I, however, must claim responsibility because I hired them, they report to me, and my name is tied to everything they do, positive and negative.

             This idea of taking full blame and fault for things that are not technically part of your job description because there is someone else who is responsible for it is just as wrong as taking credit for things that go right which are not your efforts. The good boss takes ultimate responsibility for the good and the bad and the correct and incorrect, but gives credit where credit is due. Making sure that people understand when things go right that the production crew are the ones who did a lot of the heavy lifting, and when it goes wrong making sure that people understand what when wrong and why, and that you are taking steps to correct it are all about shouldering the responsibility of leadership. Falling on the sword benefits no one.

23. I first want to say I am loving this season – while accuracy is important entertainment is paramount, and the cards against humanity and Libertalia episodes were two of my favourite episodes ever (though the resistance is still best – I hope you do resistance avalon one day). That said, I’m sure there are a lot of people who do rely on these videos to understand the rules. I would suggest making sure that the producer involved does tighten up on rules knowledge, but for the next season perhaps have a dedicated rules expert reviewing the videos before moving to post-production, to catch any errors that can then be explained with cutaways and animations. So long as you guys are havin fun, and any errors are at least explained if not caught during filming, you’ve done your job.

24. I’m looking at the large number of people it takes to make this show and I realize how little I understand this process. I could join the angry masses united in supping from the trough of outrage porn, but I would be speaking from a position of ignorance. The backlash from the self-righteous egos surprises me. I always thought the board game community was more gracious than this.

    People make mistakes. No one can police everyone all the time. Even the best made products can be flawed. As long as you’re making entertaining shows, rules accuracy is secondary at best. I’m sure you’ll learn from this and things will improve.

    In the mean time, have fun gaming. It’s what really matters.

25. Thanks for taking so much on your shoulders Wil. I believe you’ll make next years season of awesome Tabletop great.

    To the whiners. Shut your pie hole. Go away. Wil, Felicia, and G&S have made us free content and have apologized for the mistakes.

    BE AWESOME!

    1. Amen.

26. My 2 cents. I know the squeeky wheels can be loud, and it’s embarrassing to get called on doing something wrong, especially when you’re supposed to be the “expert”.

    My whole family watches your episodes and we’ve picked up a lot of games because of you. Thank you!

    Don’t let the trolls get you though.

    My 17 year old son just called me on having played SmallWorld rules wrong… (for the last year) I’m ALWAYS the one who is in charge of reading the rules and explaining them to everyone, so when I get my chops busted, I get defensive and a little embarrassed. Partly because I feel I’m doing a favor for everyone and partly because I do take some pride in being the “expert”.

    The long and short of it is, if it’s fun, and we’re all playing by the same rules, the game is “Fair & Fun”. Learning the proper rules usually just evens out game pace or adds different tactics.

    If D&D has taught me anything, it’s tempting to fight the Trolls with fire, but good armor and sharp sword are much more effective at keeping you in one piece. (armor/sword = thick skin, good judgement and remember to read each positive comment 3 times for each negative one you read)

27. So what happened to “Wheaton’s Law” ???

    I have really admired and appreciated the visibility that Wil has brought to table top gaming. I enjoy TableTop a lot, but I don’t watch every episode, and haven’t seen this one. The only thing that got me looking at this was the G&S post on Facebook re all the commenting about the episode, so I was curious.

    I find this blog by Wil to be very disappointing, and I repeat, what happened to his own “law”, “don’t be a dick”???? If Wil is ultimately responsible for the show, as I presume being “executive producer” pretty much means, then this problem should have been noticed and investigated after about 3 or 4 episodes of rules errors. At that time, you would go to that producer and find out what is going on so that you DO know whether it is burnout, carelessness, lack of preparation or being overwhelmed, and then you can DO something about it. Help that person, replace that person, hire additional resources etc.

    …. not leave it until near the end of the season and then out them publicly on the internet, ending with a rather lame, and, to me, hardly heartfelt, “oh, but yes, I’m the captain of the ship so I accept it is ultimately my responsibility”.

    Actually Wil, it IS your responsibility. And putting on my pop psychology hat, I wonder if THAT is why you are so angry?? Because you KNOW it was your responsibility, and you failed in that, and you are embarrassed for your own mistakes in this. But instead of just owning it and admitting that you didn’t keep on top of issues in production, you have chosen to blame someone who you oversee. Don’t be such a dick.

    NOTE: I admit I know nothing about media production so maybe it wouldn’t have been possible to catch this problem early in the season, but the rest of my comments still stand – you don’t blame this way, and like another commenter said, you certainly don’t “accept responsibility” this way.

    1. A word about media production, short shows (those done with minimal takes) and game shows are usually filmed several episodes back to back on the same day. In taped game shows for instance, you are asked to bring several outfits so that if you keep winning you can change clothes and film another episode. IT can be a pretty grueling schedule of filming three to four 30 minute episodes over the course of five or six hours. All that filming goes to production and the various clips and interviews and camera angles are blended together, graphics are added, etc…and this is where those rules mistakes are likely to be caught. This process of putting together a show which may have taken a couple of hours to film can take days and even up to a week, and they are all part of a queue, so you might find a mistake in four or five episodes filmed as long as a week ago.

       So how do you handle this? You discover in a short order that several epsiodes that have been filmed are now incorrect? You cannot go back and redo them, your filming schedule and budget do not allow you to scrap them and just film new episodes instead. IT is already too late to correct the person who made the mistakes. So what do you do?

       Wil made his decision, apologize, explain where the mistake happened, take responsibility that while it was one individuals job ultimately he is responsible for the final product and is taking steps to fix it in the future. But how do you personally handle this if you were Wil. Don’t talk about what you believe he should have done, what would you have done if you found yourself suddenly in this situation. No need to post, just take a moment and be completely honest with yourself and project yourself in that situation.

28. To Wil and all the G&S crew, you guys are awesome! I really enjoyed this episode. Who cares if you got the rules wrong, you guys do a great job and I can’t wait to see what comes out next! You guys are the reason that I got into table top gaming with my girlfriend and have really improved my life overall. If you guys do another set of crowd funding I’m even more on board than last time!

29. I actually preferred the way you played to the real rules. Just my opinion.

30. Screwing up the rules makes for a more realistic depiction of paying board games. 🙂

    In all seriousness, anyone that is genuinely upset about this needs to calm down a little or a lot. The point of each episode is to give you an idea of what the game is like to help better understand whether or not it would be something you and your gaming group would find entertaining. It is NOT meant to be a complete rules overview; you get enough information to understand what’s going on every turn, and that’s it.

    Even if the game was played perfectly in its respective episode, I would recommend reading through the rules at least once if you’ve never played the game before. If you want to play board games, get used to reading rule books. Also, get used to screwing up rules your first few times playing.

    As long as you have fun playing the game, the rules need not be adhered to so strictly. Houseruling is common and often encouraged even by the designers of many games.

31. Wil,

    For whatever weird reason I was not aware of TableTop until probably half way through Season 3. However, I have been so excited to experience it. I’m going through all the shows right now and I’m hooked. I do hope their is a 4th season so I can participate and help fund it if that’s the way you all go about it again.

    I know with my own experiences playing games rules get broken, amended and most definitely bent quite often. I’m sorry that you are frustrated and upset, but know that many of us are excited for what TableTop has become and can’t wait for more of it. To you, Felicia and the rest of the team at G&S, You Rock!

32. Let he who has never screwed up a games rules, throw the first stone.

    1. EXACTLY! People in glass houses should not throw stones!

33. As long as it doesn’t happen in every episode, I don’t mind. I like the show most because it gives an impression about the games. And it’s not featuring four legendary nerds in a basement, but four beautiful people in – what seemed to be – a porn set :).
    Keep up the good work!

34. If the producer is the person who I think it is, he is messing up all over the place.
    For my game group I have to remember the rules to all the games. Mistakes do get made even after playing a game multiple times. However if my JOB is to make sure the rules are met for a specific number of games then those are the ones I’m gonna get as close to 100% as I can. This isn’t gaming at home this is a show and the host can’t be expected to know everything and keep it entertaining and the audience engaged. The producers job in this instance was to make sure Wil was playing correctly and he keeps messing up.

35. Honestly your video’s make me want to buy some of these products however you play them, Nor do I tune in to be sold a product but because I find the show entertaining.

    I watched Kingdom builder and I thought “that looks fun” with no prior knowledge of the game I didn’t know you got it wrong and I still don’t know how you got it wrong, I only found out by following a link from the guys at Shut up and Sit Down.

    As I understand it your goal is to get more people into gaming in general. You are still succeeding in that and being too harsh on yourself, I’d hate to see this self recrimination damage a fantastic show.

36. I feel silly in saying this Wil but I know of no other way to tell you personally but your Tabletop shows have meant the world to me and have helped me become a more healthier person…as corny as it sounds.

    I suffer from major depression, high anxiety and panic attacks. Due to my illness, my world has shrunk into a small sphere over the last decade, only letting 2-3 people into what remains of it….however….

    Your shows brought back the great memories of my past when I used to play games with family and friends. I would of never known about all the great and wonderful co-op games out there if not for your show. They have inspired me to use games as a tool for personal interaction, to bring me back into the world of the living, a world of family and friends.

    Keep your spirits up Wil, no matter what the disgruntled say about you or your show, they have have meant the world to me and to a lot of us. Everyone makes mistakes, me, you, your producer, the audience who watches Tabletop…we all make mistake, we are human are we not?

    I hope in the future you can still find enough enjoyment and satisfaction in producing these wonderful shows to bring the Tabletop fans more exposure and joy of table top gaming.

37. Meh, it happens – especially when you are regularly playing and introducing new games. Sometimes rules get screwed up a little, sometimes a lot, as long as people have fun I don’t think it matters that much.

    Since you are kind of being a ground-breaker and many people your videos, maybe you are more concerned. But don’t let it (or any negative feedback) get you down. Worst case scenario: admit the rules were messed up, laugh it off, and try playing again another time. 🙂

    Love the show, and think you are doing great work to promote people getting together and having fun!

38. I appreciate the fact that you are taking responsibility for this big screw-up. I appreciate that you are providing an explanation as to what happened, instead of just being silent on it. We’ve all screwed up on playing games and learned from it. I also get that this seems to be a first for you and your staff to deal with this.

    That said, throwing someone under the bus in the process of apologizing, in a public forum, is a bit TMI at the very least, is Bad Form Jack in general, and if you are this person’s direct employer, could open yourself up to a legal can of worms.

    The times in our personal and professional lives we call “Lessons Learned” always seem to be the most painful ones to learn at the time.

39. I’m just a mom and a backer of this show. If I’m correct, you set out to bring board game night back to the family table. I speak for those I know, none of which are famous bloggers, actors, or anyone with “clout.”

    Mission accomplished, Wil. My family, friends, and neighbors have all benefited from your show. Every week we watch you have a good time playing with fun people. We then get out our games and have a wonderful time. Many of those games we wouldn’t know about if not for your show.

    So thank you, and I do not give a rat’s ass if you messed up the rules. Call them “Tabletop House Rules” and let these people who are so angry deal with it.

    I understand if you don’t want to deal with this bombardment of awful any more, just remember that somewhere in the middle of the country there are many more families enjoying games together and laughing a whole lot because of what you and Felicia accomplished. (Pooping position comes up quite a bit, but what can I do? I’m surrounded by boys)

    Again, thank you for your time,

    Zuntite. (Second row of bricks down, second in, I believe.)

40. This season of tabletop kinda lost me, not because of any rule mishaps, but because of the casting, lengths and game choices. Probably just not my cup of tea, but hey, loved the first two seasons! 🙂 Anyway, I think this isn’t the right way to approach this (totally dumb and unnecessary) shietstorm. You’re feeding into the nay-sayers and throwing someone from your production team under the bus while doing so. You’re pointing out multiple times how they screwed up and how you’re not to blame but hey, you graciously take the blame anyway, but remember: THEY SCREWED UP. You know? That’s what I get from this post.
    You’re only human and you get frustrated by this because this show is your baby, I get that, but you’re also a public figure and this outburst isn’t very professional. Personally, I think it is totally okay to rant about this and complain about your producer at home, to your co-workers… whatever really. But doing this so horribly/publicly lacks a certain kind of maturity and professionalism.

41. This show has made me love games so much more and gives me so many more options before I buy. I have brought about 8 games as a direct result of watching this show. Thanks you so much!!!!

42. “I take responsibility for these mistakes.”

    Except you really didn’t. You placed blame on the producer, heavily and at length. And then as an afterthought, you tossed in that line because you’ve heard grownups say that. But you don’t get to start out nailing the crap out of someone and explaining how it’s their fault and you’re furious at them, and then play the captain’s card. You really don’t.

43. Wil, I am a game developer, responsible for some pretty popular games for a very well known company… I get my own rules wrong sometimes…not often but it does happen. I get the rules wrong for games I play where the developers of it taught me how to play. And I get the rules wrong when I’m reading the book by myself to learn how to play.

    Any serious gamer who gives you grief about this is being a hypocrite. Yes, getting them right is important, and yes there is a huge audience that assumes what they watch you do is the correct way to play, but everyone gets the rules wrong sometimes. Everyone.

    You owned up to it, that means a lot. You could have just gotten defensive or ignored it, but you confronted it. For that alone you are worthy of respect. That you feel bad about it means even more to me because it means you care about my games as much as I do, and that you understand the rather unique position you are in as a “tastes maker.”

    Do a season four, get it right as your standards dictate (which should allow for mistakes because they will happen), and people will stick with you. Your next Tabletop kickstarter? I’m already in line to donate.

44. My take on this – if this is the producer that everyone seems to think it is then look beyond TT.

    Over a year ago a certain TT producer sat in front of the TT logo on set to film a video to promote a KickStarter game project that he was running. He used TT as a tacit endorsement for his project, which is in reality unrelated to TT. The project raised over target (~$40k) and hundreds of backers looked forward to eventually getting the game. In the 15 months since then he has barely communicated with his backers, prefering instead to blame everyone else for that fact that he’d got his math wrong, couldn’t fulfil the project, had to find a publisher, said he had then that fell through claiming recently to have found another. This was only communicated to backers via an interview with a third party where he mainly blamed the negative persecution he was receiving from his backers for not communicating with them as the reason he didn’t communicate with his backers … ?!?!?!? This individual, who I’m sure if I met him I’d find very personable and pleasant, has begun to look a bit stretched, unprofessional and flakey.

    In a nutshell there’s more that what happened in the TT studio behind this situation. For more info about the KS visit https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/gamesmith/pirate-den

45. YOU are the Executive Producer.
    YOU went before the globe and asked for money to make this.
    YOU need to take responsibility.

    It is a shame that the person you hired was untrustworthy and failed you – but, you hired this person. All roads lead back to you.

    To go online and blame another for your mistakes is sad and petty.

    You get paid to play games.

    Learn that rules.

    Bonus advice: Be a gentlemen and apologize for this post.

46. I don’t care that you messed up rules; everybody does that, and nobody dies. I do care that you treated somebody you supposedly trusted like crap in public. Deal with this stuff in private, like a human being.

47. All these pretentious butthurt whiners need to seriously get a life (not to mention take a shower) and look in the mirror more often, everyone makes mistakes – we are all human. These are just games and getting a rule wrong will not cause the Earth to crash into the Sun.

    The only thing Wil should be concerned with is keeping politics and religion out of the show.

48. I can’t believe people here using phrases like “shame on you”. Shame? Really? Perhaps you don’t know how strong that word is. Shame is deep and ugly, it is not something you would wish upon someone who you care about or, if you lack empathy, someone whose work you care about. I am a backer of season 3 and will happily back season 4. I have watched since the first episode and have turned my husband into an addict and avid game player as well. There is nothing wrong with trusting someone to do their job, and there is nothing wrong with explaining to the members of your community what happened when that job wasn’t done properly. It’s not dodging accountability, it is being transparent.

    The best part of being a geek/nerd/gamer/etc is the community, it’s also the worst. This is an opportunity to be supportive of the creator and the content we enjoy, don’t be the hate that outsiders hear about.

49. A lot of blame game going on. It’s hard to swollow when the majority of the post was blaming one person and the a quick sentence taking responsibility. I was disappointed to read you do not know what went wrong with the person who clearly did a great job in the first two seasons. Perhaps instead of looking for someone to lynch, whether it be the producer or Wil, we just say ‘something went wrong with the process’. Here there are options to improve. I dont trust processes that simply blame and get rid of people. These are destined to repeat themselves. Maybe putting the task on one person was unrealistic, maybe the person was in need of help and the process did not offer an avenue of asking for help, maybe there were circumstances that only hindsight can make clear that will aid in preparing next season.
    Wil, the producer, all of us fail. It won’t change, but let’s stop the blame game and look where the real issues might be to ensure genuine learning from these mistakes. Especially before they get blown out of proportion.

50. As others have said, getting the rules wrong is part of the hobby.

    The first time I played Pandemic with my wife, we got the infection phase wrong and we were adding 3 cubes per city instead of 1. We had unwitti gly invented ‘nightmare’ difficulty level. It took us maybe 3 or 4 playthroughs before we noticed our mistake. Everytime we lost, I would say “wow, lost again, but this game is supposed to be tough, so let’s try again, I’m sure we’ll beat it this time!”.
    Since the pandemic incident we take extra care with rule reading.

    Don’t worry Wil, I’m sure that almost everyone has a similar tale about how they screwed up some rule with a new boardgame. Us viewers don’t require Tabletop to be perfect, just the fact that it exists and is spreading the gaming hobby is the greatest thing.

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