For months, whenever I visit gaming sites I care about, someone is laying into me about Tabletop. Things like, “He doesn’t care about the fans” and “He took everyone’s money and didn’t spend it on the show” and “Nobody who is a real gamer takes this show seriously” or “I hate Tabletop because [thing someone decided I did, whether I actually did it or not.]”
I’m pretty good at not having a fuck to give about things, especially from power gamers who aren’t in my target audience, and who will probably never be happy with what I do. For the first two seasons of Tabletop, “Thank you for your comment. Please direct any further comments to that brick wall, and remember that we made this for free,” was my standard response. The people who loved what we did vastly outnumbered the people who complained about the show and about me and about all the delightful things people complain about. And that’s fine. Not everyone likes everything. My goal was to make more gamers in the world, and we’ve certainly succeeded in that. If we never make any more Tabletop, I’ll always feel very good about that.
There’s this thing that we talk about in production, in acting classes, and on the set. It’s this idea that if you feel good about something you made or worked on, and someone shits on it, who cares? You’re happy with it, you made the thing you wanted to make, and they made comments. You can stand by your choices. But there’s another side of it, and it’s why so many of my fellow creative people are as selective as they can be about the projects they do: when you do something that you don’t feel good about, whatever the reason was that you did it, and someone shits on it, it strikes a nerve. When you should have known better, and you didn’t trust your instincts, it strikes a nerve. When you count on someone to do the thing they were supposed to do, and they didn’t, it strikes a nerve.
So when I am accused, over and over and over again of not caring about Tabletop, not caring enough to get the rules right, not caring about the audience, or feeling complacent because of reasons — it strikes a nerve, because I work incredibly hard to be good to our audience. It strikes a nerve because I care a lot, especially this season, because for over twenty thousand people, it wasn’t free, and the only brick wall I care about has all their names on it. Written by hand, by amazing production assistants.
Yesterday, after being beaten up on r/boardgames yet again, I wanted to address that, and explain how things happened this season that are not up to my standards. It wasn’t my intention to do any of the things I’ve been accused of doing, but enough people I trust and respect have all said the same thing to me, so I clearly didn’t communicate my feelings clearly. I counted on someone who had never let me down, and they profoundly let me down, when it mattered the most. I feel that the backers of the show deserve to know what happened, why it happened, and how it made me feel. What I wanted to say was: this is what happened. This is why that happened. This is how it made me feel. I am angry, and embarrassed, and I kind of don’t even want to do another season of the show.
I didn’t do that well. I stand by telling the truth about what happened, but I wish I’d done it in a better way. I hope you’ll continue to enjoy Tabletop, because a lot of people worked very hard to make it the best show we could make it. In a lot of ways, I believe we have succeeded. In some other ways, we’ve clearly fallen short. I want you to know that I care. I cared during production, and I care now. I realize that this will continue to not be good enough for some people, unnecessary for others, and is unlikely to do anything other than prolong the Internet hatefest I’m presently receiving. But this is one of those things that I need to write for me.
I accept responsibility for my tone, and my words. I don’t apologize for being angry, embarrassed, and disappointed.
I feel like I managed to alienate myself from a community that I love and care about, and I may never be let back in. That hurts a lot, but if it’s a self-inflicted wound, I have nobody to blame but myself. I can’t even blame the dice.
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The Wheaton Effect is a real thing. For every complainer (and I think there are very few), there are a thousand people inspired by each episode to go buy the game they watched you play.
You create new experiences and new realities for countless viewers. I hope you don’t give that up.
Hey man, you are amazing. You are a talented, smart, and entertaining individual. I love the show, and I love that you care so much about it. I personally can tell that you put a TON of effort in. As someone who has worked production in plays and musicals, I can see all of the small stuff that goes into the final product–and it is a lot. Some people has rage and hatred in their hearts, which is unfortunate. The best advice I have, though I so rarely follow it myself, is to ignore the haters, or if not, forgive them for not understanding everything, when possible. The most important thing you can do though, is to forgive yourself. You are only human WIl. You worked hard, and shit happened. It sucks, but it happens. In theater, as I am sure you are aware, sometimes a line is dropped, a vital line, or someone misses their cue, or a prop breaks. When this happens, you have to just go with it. Apologize afterwards, if needed, and then move on, because beating yourself up won’t fix anything. The past in the past, and you must look to the future.
I hope this helps you, and I hope you read it.
Cheers and DFTBA
I get what you’re trying to say.
As a starting writer, I’ve had to take on subjects that embarrass me. I hate certain kinds of articles and when people point out that I’ve had to write some, I get very sensitive about it. I’m sorry that anyone has made you feel that way about any part of your Tabletop series.
Everyone in my group of friends is a big fan of Tabletop. We have most of the games that you’ve featured and often reference episodes when playing them (Felicia Day and her zombie storyline in “Last Night on Earth,” your wife’s epic table-smack that undid an entire game of “Ticket to Ride,” etc.). The thing is, we don’t watch the show just to be introduced to the rules. There are instruction booklets for that.
Simply put, rules aren’t everything.
My whole group plays “Quarriors” with such ridiculous house rules, that you wouldn’t recognize it. Tabletop RPG games, like the older White Wolf versions, insist that the rules are guidelines. In the end, games are for fun. They’re not launch codes.
I can’t speak for your entire fan-base, but I’m quite authorized to speak for my little group. We watch Tabletop to find out these other games exist and to watch the hilarity unfold as you and your guests play. I don’t think screwing up a few rules is all that bad. I think it’s like giving us an alternate option.
Whatever happens, you’re always going to be one of us. A gamer. That being said, you’ve been online long enough to know that you can’t listen to the negative or that’s all you’ll see. There’s too much of it, and not enough empathy or forgiveness. Paying attention to it is how things get out of hand and posts with the wrong tone get made.
Keep believing in your show, because we do.
Tabletop is fantastic and the major selling point is not the game rules nor the production values. It’s the dynamic at the table, which is also the most important thing when playing any game.
Board games attract different types of people, and the kind of people who get angry over incorrect rules are one. Probably less than half the game I’ve played have been played with 100% correct rules, but it doesn’t matter because that’s not actually what it’s about. It’s about having a great time. No one cared we forgot a couple of rules or played a couple wrong. People will still buy Coup because of your episode.
I don’t comment here very often, but I suspect I am one of the placid-yet-happy majority which rarely tells the creators how much we enjoy their work.
I like Tabletop. I like Wil.
You owe me nothing, but you made me happy.
This is a simple (but genuine) thank you.
I do hope you make more Tabletop because I really enjoy that show. But, even if you don’t, I will still be grateful for what you’ve already given us and will know that you don’t owe us anything more.
+1
“I feel like I managed to alienate myself from a community that I love and care about, and I may never be let back in.”
As someone who was critical of your approach with your previous post, I would like to apologize for any part I may have played in making you feel that way.
This was a good season of Tabletop, warts and all. You’re an amazing person, Mr. Wheaton, and your desire to turn out a product of the absolute highest quality is part of that. And if there’s anyone who feels that you don’t deserve to be part of this community (or that you were ever NOT part of it), they’re a jerk and you should ignore them.
I love tabletop. I watch it with my son and in second place it is because it is a fantastic show. On first place it is because of you, Wil.
Im gonna quote your brother – DUDE…..
My dude means: 1,dude, You know you do your best….
2, dude, We know you do your best….
3, dude, its just some fucking games….
4, dude, there are kids starving in the world….
Big kiss from La Swecia! /Johan
Wil, My family and I love Tabletop (and the new Titansgrave). Thank you and all of the staff for providing this entertaining look at new and different board games. I appreciate the acknowledgment of when mistakes are made as we often use your show to help us understand how the game is supposed to be played. Just the simple pop up explanation that you use when things go wrong is enough to educate us on what to do. Mistakes are bound to be made but at the end of the day your show is about entertainment, and you certainly do provide entertainment for my family. Thank you again for Tabletop and please keep helping people to play more games.
Wil it was tabletop that really made me delve out of video gaming and such by showing how much fun and amazing board/card games can be. I would be utterly devastated if you qhit tabletop because some people don’t agree with you or have disagreements with you. One thing you have to remember is everyone has an opinion especially on the internet and more people complain about a product than praise it. Sad truth. Don’t let a subreddit get you down…or think they hold the entirety of a gaming community because they don’t. Youtube is where you are catering your work and that is where you should focus. Reddit is great and all (I am a regular) but they don’t speak for the masses as a whole. I love everything you have done. You are the reason I have spent thousands of dollars on board and card games in the last couple years. I have a new appreciation for you and games because of tabletop and I have never felt like you intentionally messed something up or didn’t care about the community or audience….because if you didn’t care then tabletop wouldn’t exist. The fact that it does and continues to (and I hope for a long time) shows that you care. Thank you Wil for everything. I appreciate you and your fans appreciate you more than you probably realize.
At the end of the day, if you decide to make another season and to crowdfund it and people still chip in to help you make it, that’s the answer.
Wil,
I’m a game operative for Atlas Games, and MIB for Steve Jackson Games and an Operative for Z-Man games. Up until last year, I was none of these things. Two events changed that. One: I met people who brought me into the world of tabletop gaming who thought I could teach well and Two: I started watching Tabletop. I learned from you how to enjoy teaching new games to people and express the joy of board games in ways I was previously ignorant of. Every week I am eager to see the next episode of Table Top because of you. I have a list of games I want to add to my collection because you made them apparent, and I’ve been building my FLGS’s collection of board games and have managed to sell many copies of games I love because of what I learned from you.
You are one of my heroes and someone I want to meet and play with in real life. I’m always grinning whenever I watch something of your creation, and I repeatedly watch your videos…even falling asleep to them when I have the playlist going on my phone. XD
You are amazing in what you do, and the people who heckle and criticize don’t understand the pressure you’re under as a creator and a teacher. You’re human. You may flub rules every once in a while, but that NEVER detracts from the fun you have. People can look in the box for rules if they’re that concerned. I really hope you continue into Season 4, because I intend to back it and any other projects you have.
We actually have a mutual friend here in Hickory, NC where I live. I demo games at a little store called The Spot, and spend much of my time chatting with Johnny Klutz, one of the owners who also happens to get involved with movies and TV stuff.
Don’t let the trolls and assholes get you down. For each of their voices yelling out vitriol at you, there are hundred more who excitedly watch Tabletop like me. You will always have a place in the community of gamers…even if it’s a little difficult to wade through the trouble.
You’ve impacted me so much. Thank you for being such an amazing role model. One of my goals is that one day I can meet you face to face and thank you in person and sit down to a game with you. Keep going on and remember to “play more games!”.
Hey Wil,
As one of those backers who handed over my own money to back Tabletop and Titansgrave, I don’t feel let down at all. You filmed multiple episodes back to back on an aggressive schedule, and often stated that you were mentally and physically exhausted at the end of each day. I would imagine a lot of your crew would have been feeling the same way.
Mistakes were made, it happens. Once my friends and I realised we had been playing Arkham Horror wrong for the last 2 years (turns out you can’t use weapons to close gates. Whoops.) We didn’t do that in front of an audience of thousands, so we can get away with that.
I haven’t read the reddit post, but based on what you have written today I would assume it was probably not very tactful, and may have violated Wheaton’s Law. I am sure you would handle it differently if you had your time again.
It’s obvious how much you care about these shows. I saw your face during the interview with Ivan when you were told Episode 0 had launched. You looked petrified, your baby was out in the wild and you had no idea how it would be received.
If you do decide to crowdfund Tabletop S4, Titansgrave S2, or another project, know that a lot of us would quite willingly back you on those ventures. We know it won’t be perfect, because you aren’t, and I certainly am not perfect either. But we know that you will try your hardest to get as close as possible.
Now go play with your dogs, or hang out with your family. That’s an order. 🙂
Every word in this is truth, and well said
For the love of Glob, please continue Tabletop if you can! I don’t know what bridges those gaming sites are under, but apparently the trolls are short of goats to bother.
My son and I have a much-loved, much-played collection of board games solely due to Tabletop. I grew up being trounced at Scrabble by my dad and once thought that that was the spectrum of board gaming possibilities.
We love watching Tabletop together, and we choose what games we’re going to look for next based on what you guys play that seems up our respective alleys. He’s a 12-year-old boy and I’m a single mom – there wouldn’t be many ways for us to connect without gaming. And he thinks you’re hilarious and rad. Just so you know.
So you phrased your feelings in a problematic way in a public forum. Everyone does that at some point, and when I think about the things that I’ve said that I was so, so sure were the right words in the moment that turned out to be exactly the wrong words later on… well, there are a f***load of ’em. We all mess up. Producers, bloggers, politicians, oceanographers, even Jeff Goldblum… everyone makes mistakes.
There is a way through; there is always a way past. Anyone who expects you to be anything more or less than human is deluded, but any time we expect that of anyone, we’re deluded.
So we all have to take care of each other and keep working at communication until we get it right – because the future of our species kind of depends on getting our shit together, and this small moment in time doesn’t define anything but this small moment in time. This, too, shall pass.
I love Tabletop. I never comment, but I watch it every week! It helped me impress my new boyfriend with my knowledge of games despite not having people to play with (until I met him!). I think you are doing a great job. Keep it going!
Hi Wil. I’m not usually a person to post to things like this but here goes.
You sir are doing good things. You have been bringing exposure to something that you wanted to share. You brought your self out in the open for basically the whole world to see for good or bad and that takes guts. It takes a strong person to be able to do that, I hope you know that.
You’re making content ( for free ) for something personal to you. Your detractors couldn’t/ wouldn’t put them selves in that position. Unfortunately the Internet is full of people who are self entitled to shred apart people for small, simple reasons and usually enmass.
In honestly your the reason that my own passion in roleplaying and board games have come back after an almost 20 year hiatus. I know it’s true for alot of people out there. I’m sure you have more support than not. I wouldn’t blame you for stepping bac for a bit.
Thanks for doing what you do sir! ( hope you have a great father’s day as well )
Bravo, Wil! You realized what you did and stood up to it. You don’t have to pay attention to the haters, or the detractors. But you should be reflective and always be willing to admit it when you’ve done something wrong. HOW you handled the mistake was the key – and you nailed it by admitting it to yourself and went a step further and admitted it publicly.
TableTop is awesome – and I don’t ever want it to end. It doesn’t matter what power gamers, rules lawyers or generally jealous bastards say.
I want the entertainment, I want more boardgamers. I’m fine with occasionally missing a rule or accidentally playing incorrectly. Did everyone have fun? Did someone find out about a specific game, or about playing these wonderful games in general, and decide to try it? I have a huge groups of gaming friends, causal to hard core, and they love your show.
I own 700+ boardgames. I was holding off buying Kingdom Builder, have been hesitant for years. I watched the KB episode and I’ve placed my order now. What does that say?
Keep up the awesome work. Know that with the each negative, hateful troll out there hiding behind their keyboard, you have also have somebody else pulling for you in your corner.
Your show is fantastic mostly because of your obvious and sincere passion. It is contagious. Please don’t stop making it. I for one will contribute to your next crowdfund.
I don’t watch Tabletop for rules clarification. I watch it to see friends actively enjoy an interesting game, and get introduced to new stuff.
Tabletop is the single biggest influencer on my friends and I restarting a regular monthly boardgame night (and a weekly one with my kids) and has introduced me to more new games than anything (Forbidden Island/Dessert, Resistance, Last Night on Earth, Geek Out, Castle Panic, Wits & Wagers, Zombie Dice). I was happy to sponsor this season, and would do it again.
It’s not like I’ve never screwed up the rules during a game before. You own up to it, fix it the next time, and keep playing. Key word we need to remember: Playing. Keep at it, Wil.
Count me in as one of the people who enthusiastically await each episode of TableTop, and now Titansgrave. I rarely ever comment, because for the most part it would always be something of the “great episode” variety. Are there certain games that TableTop has featured which I don’t care for? Yes, certainly. Most times, however, I continue to watch the episode anyway because I find it interesting to watch a group of people have fun playing a game that they enjoy.
Like others have said, there are a number of new board games that have entered my possession since TableTop premiered solely because I saw them on TableTop. To put that in perspective, I have picked up more new board or card games in the past 3 years than I have in the previous 15. Additionally, I started my own game night tradition with a bunch of friends, so that once a month we can get together and play something we enjoy or try something new.
I don’t know what some other people might be complaining about. I am a Season 3 backer and I have been getting EVERYTHING that I signed up for. TableTop is back in a third season, there are new games being played, you and the guests all seem to truly be enjoying your time playing, and the RPG show (Titansgrave) is off to a great start.
Thanks to you I will continue to… Play More Games!
Oh, and Happy Father’s Day from one dad to another.
Just wanted to thank you for the show. A good friend of mine owns a game store (mad hatters house of of games Lubbock tx( shameless plug)) and he has seen a huge upswing in the boardgame sales. The show has had my youngest son and friends wanting to sit down and give the games I have a try.
For me gaming has never been about the rules or even winning or losing. It’s been about enjoying a community of fun and interesting people and I see that on tabletop no matter who the guessed is. You have given the muggles a look in to the hobbie I love and have made countless friends through. That is what matters. The nay sayers are missing out in on what the show is about and the fun of gaming is about.
I didn’t see this before I posted, but I’m glad we all seem to share the same thoughts.
Seriously? Wil, what the hell man – Tabletop rocks! I had no idea some people didn’t like it, and well, they don’t have to like it, whup di do.
Stop being such a perfectionist and go “Well, shit, my team and I have created something that hasn’t existed before, loads of people love it, some people don’t, either way the bills are getting paid” and stop beating yourself up.
Dear Mr Wheaton,
I tried to send this as an email (including the script to your wilwheaton.net address but it is not working, so imposting here instead..
My name Is Keith Appleby, producer of a new feature length horror film called “The Cornwall”, we would like to speak with you regarding the potential of taking part in the main role in the film..
Of course, good pay and expenses will be included.. and we are expecting to shoot over a two month period, in 2016.
I have enclosed a copy of the synopsis for your viewing ,
we would be looking at paying you a real decent fee for 2 months filming, as well as an additional fee for 1-2 days trailer filming..
Please let me know as soon as possible.
Synopsis
Jack is a happy go lucky amateur astronomer, who decides it is time to propose to his long-time girlfriend Alice during a romantic weekend in an old Cornish Cottage. The night in question being extremely rare and special due to the return of “The Comet” that appears only once every 273 years.
Unbeknownst to Jack, his Girlfriend Alice and their Five year old son Ewan, this also brings the return of the spirit of “The Witch” who in the 1800’s was burned at the stake for sacrificing Children in the local river.
The weekend begins without any issues, that is until they meet Moon, a ditty old lady from the next cottage along, and things begin to go oddly.
Slowly but surely moon begins to work her way into the family, creating an air of tension between herself and Alice, as moon is fascinated by Ewan, the little boy, and Is regularly seen around the boy, whispering to him.
During the evening, Jack finds a stuffed Raven under the boy’s bed, and returns to Moons cottage in order to have it out with her, however she is not around, we find lots of interesting books on demon summoning, and incantations.
When Moon returns to her cottage, jack is no longer there, and we realize that moon is a witch with the use of magic.
A large influx of crows, one with white eyes, begin to plague the family, before finally late on the first night Alice becomes puppet to the witches’ evil plan. Under the control of the witch she kidnaps her own son, and taking him to the local river to sacrifice.
In order to keep jack away, the ravens attack him in the cottage, where he puts up a valiant fight.
Eventually Jack and Moon turn up as Alice is drowning her son, and team up to defeat the plans of the Witch before she can return to exact revenge and to begin her reign of terror once again.
It is at this point we find out that Moon is actually a white witch, and her job is to make sure that the evil witch does not return to the earth, as such she was protecting the young boy.
A battle of magic ensues, before Jack drowns his wife in the water in the river, killing her and the witch in one stroke. Devastated at what he has done, he takes the ring and places it on her finger, which imbued with his love returns Alice to the world of the living.
The film ends, with the white raven, making another appearance as the family drive off in their car. It has a short staring competition with Moon before flying off after the car.
Spoilers?
You know, I’m sure Mr. Wheaton has representation, perhaps you could try his agent? Assuming this is legit. 🙂
You are correct, Mr Wheaton does have agents who work for him, however have you ever tried to deal with an agent.
Firstly they don’t want to know unless
you are a respected film producer
They want a pay or play agreement (which means, even if you cant get the funds, they still want the pay, and this is before you get a yes or no.)
You hardly ever get a response from them.
They can be arrogant, and it doesn’t matter how good the script is, they wont pass it on if they don’t like it.
They want a cut of Mr Wheaton’s wage.. why should i pay them for Mr Wheaton’s services. Sounds daft when the full amount should go to him for his skills
I prefer to deal direct, as i have done on numerous occasions, with Mr Paul Daniels and Mr Craig Charles.. Once they OK the idea, then i can deal with agents. Makes life so much easier.
Secondly, please feel free to visit the Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/thecornwall2015 for more info.
Cheers
Keith Appleby BA
Producer “The Cornwall”
Keith, I say this with kindness: until you are ready to work with the people we hire to represent and work with us, you’re going to have a bad time.
Hi Will,
Firstly please don’t get me wrong, I do work with agents. however, i tend to do so once i have managed to peak the interest of the client first. To date, i have had more luck this way.
I am aware, that it is difficult to do in this way, however, i find that speaking one on one can provide more answers, than going through an agent.
I did this with Mr Paul Daniels, The agent was contacted after i had discussed the project with Mr Daniels. which turned out to be a success, (it was for a uni project) at first the agent stated that Mr Daniels would not be interested since it was free work. however, i had already discussed it with him thus the contracts were made, and signed.
I have had some bad experiences with agents.. One, blatantly told me to contact them next year for one project. Not even a let us have a look.. Just contact us next year.
If you can provide me with your agents details, i will gladly contact them.
thank you..
keith Appleby
Well after 3 hours of searching i finally found who i think is your agent.. so i have contacted them, Not sure what your fees are, but we are offering £15,000 UK pounds. $23,000 for 2 months shooting..
we shall see what your agents say.
I just want to say that I have really enjoyed Tabletop and I hope to continue to do so in the future. I really enjoy seeing the games being played. I hope that the waves of positivity overcome the negativity that you are feeling.
I’m the vocal minority it seems. I like what you do. Carry on.
So sorry to hear life has been kicking you in the back of the seat.
I hope you can have a Happy Father’s day despite anything else going on Wil.
I read the previous post, about the rules misstakes and felt it a bith harsly worded and throwing under buss-esque and was dissapointed, not due to the rules misstakes, every board gamer know that those happens, but to the tone you took and the outward standard that showed.
But here you are, doing a thing that few ever do, owning up to it, making it better and clarifying and that’s harder than delivering a perfect, scripted post from the outset.
We are all human, emotion get a hold of us and carry us to places we did not intend.
Thank you for making this post and as a board gamer I can tell you that you will always be welcome at a table I’m at.
Do not listen to those giving unjustified critice, they are few but loud.
This season has had some great episodes with some very different games I would not have known about if you hadn’t played them.
You have acknowledged and addressed (presumably) the problem.
Now play more games.
Tabletop or not, this is about community. It’s never been about rules, but about having fun. I’m constantly talking about and suggesting games to people I interact with, and that’s because of the fundamental “play more games” attitude. I play games nearly everyday and when I lose or win I have to remember my composure, because it could have gone the other way just as easily. Whether or not you care for the show or Wil and his guests, think about what they have done for the tabletop gaming community and how much it has grown, due to their work. So, let’s stop talking about these trivial matters and start rolling some dice or pulling cards, if that’s your thing.
Hugs, hugs and hugs. Hey I love the show and what you have been doing. Keep up the great work and I look forward to more.
Wil, My friends and I loved the show since we first saw season one. I have watched every episode and many if not all of the games we have are from seeing you and YOUR friends play on the show. I anxiously wait for every new episode.I love the show keep it up!
My daughter (11) and I are both dyslexic and we love to play games together. The obvious problem is that written rules sheets are literally impossible for us to follow.
It’s led to a number of great games being shelved at our house because we can’t ‘get’ the rules.
Tabletop is invaluable for us and we consistently watch and buy the games you play. Sometimes even the shelved games at home can come down because you guys explain/play them on the show.
Thank you for everything, and I hope to see more episodes in the future.
I like WIl because he’s human. He acts human. I WANT him to act human. Not like the standard ‘PAY NO ATTENTION TO THE MAN BEHIND THE CURTAIN’ that we tend to get of our cultural icons and the faceless nameless machines behind many of them. I had no problems with his reactions then, and still don’t, because they are very human, and were in no way (IMHO) inappropriate.
I love Tabletop. I just recently discovered it. I’m a 40-something geek who never cared a flying fig about board games, and now I’m hooked. I would be very sad if there was never another season of Tabletop because the vocal self-righteous few.
Keep doing the good work and continue the show, it is fantastic. If you get some rules wrong, so what? it’s not a game advertising show and it’s not a “learn to play this game” show either. I feel it’s more about the people and the interaction of the players that makes the game hilarious, and that’s how I feel about boardgames overall. A good game is bad with the wrong people at the table.
I’m not sure what people are taking issue with and tbh, i don’t care. There are so many haters and tearer-downers out there, I have to put them on mute or abandon the internet forever and we all know that’s not an option,
What i do care about is that you sound genuinely bummed about it and for that, I too am bummed. I’m sorry things didn’t go according to plan and that peeps were unreliable. That sucks hardcore when something you put your all into, that you nurture and care for and love, isn’t quite what you expect.
I also care about the show and about you and about all the people out there that have been inspired to play more games, ie interact with other humans in a social and enjoyable way. That’s a pretty dope legacy.
I donated to Tabletop and would do it again today. I’m def not a hardcore gamer, but I am one of those regular peeps that was inspired by you and your friends and fam on the show to get back to the board.
My 6 year old son knows that we celebrate Tabletop Day as a holiday along with Christmas and Free Comic Book Day and he has a towering stack of games that we can play face to face not on a screen. That’s on you, kid. So, thanks for that.
I was and am still critical of your previous post.
That said, I hardly think it warrants ‘banishing’ from the board game community! Your passionate and sterling back catalogue of work has earned you more than one bad day.
That said, it’s a shame you don’t feel sufficient remorse for publicly outing/flagellating your rules producer to warrant an unreserved apology for that action (which came across as totally shitty).
The ‘sin’ is rarely in the making of the mistake – it’s in the failure to recognise and/or rectify it.
But then, I don’t live inside your brain sir and I wasn’t there. You may have your reasons for your stance.
I for one hope you continue to host Tabletop – Play more games! 🙂
Wil, I hope you see this. I love tabletop. I’m a hardcore gamer and I don’t care that you sometimes mess up the rules. I don’t watch tabletop to find out how to play a game (with the exception of the Fiasco episodes, those have been invaluable for teaching others how to play Fiasco, thank you). I watch tabletop because it’s fun, sometimes it’s funny, it’s interesting, I can see the components of a game and watch people play it, if I’m still interested I go look for other reviews or lets plays before I make a purchase, you’re not letting me down as a fan if you make a mistake. I would watch tabletop if it was just you and your family (or not famous friends) around your dining room table and filmed on an iPhone. Please keep making Tabletop. And please make a second season of Titansgrave, 2 episodes in I’m hooked (to be honest, you had me at the Darmok and Jalad reference in episode 0, with open arms). Titansgrave is probably the best thing to happen to RPGs since the FIasco episodes of Tabletop, please keep at it man.
To badly paraphrase Warhol: Don’t pay attention to what they say, just measure it in column inches. All that hate just means that you are living rent free in their brains, or something.
Hi Wil,
I also totally love the show and am proud to be a backer!
I really don’t care if the rules are not always followed completely as we are all human and humans do make mistakes!
If anything it makes the show even more relateable.
So please keep up the great work and let a fourth season happen! I would be among the first to back!
Don’t be a dick and DFTBA,
Christian
Damn the haters. Tabletop is about having fun and it is. So give them 0 f**ks
I backed this season, and I’ll be first in line to back the next if you decide to do that again. Tabletop’s still great; I’ve enjoyed every episode.
I seldom watch TV any more because I have so many other things to do that take up that time.
One of them is Tabletop.
I love your shows, and hope you continue to make them.
They got me back into gaming, and I’m loving it.
On a side note, having screwed up the rules in a few of my games playing them for the first time, I have to say I think the rulebooks are generally very poorly written.
I bought and played Munchkin, which I loved on your show, and the rules while funny, are hopeless when you want to quickly work out what to do with 5~6 people impatiently waiting to get on in front of you.
I can fully understand how hard it must be to get these details right
with the number of games you play back to back.
I continue to look forward to the rest of this season, and the next one. 🙂
Wil, everything has been spectacular. Screw ups and all. The fact that you can admit to them means you’re better than most. I don’t think you did anything wrong.
Tabletop gets me out of the house and forces me to socialize with complete strangers, if only for an hour or two once a week.
I don’t have immediate internet access where I live, so watching Tabletop at home isn’t an option. Recently, my local game store began airing episodes on a big screen TV, in their gaming area, and afterward people tend to hang out and play the game-we-just-watched-played or something else until the store closes.
Pushing myself out of the house to sit and watch a show with complete strangers around me (cinemas are somewhat easier due to the darkness) and then playing-or even just watching-a game with said strangers takes tremendous amounts of effort, and the “high” I experience after having pressed on through my social anxiety lasts almost to the point where it keeps me from getting any sleep later that night, and I have to get up at 4:30AM the next morning for my job….
Bottom line: the words “thank you” aren’t remotely sufficient to convey the appreciation I have for the way Tabletop helps me, and yet they’re the only words I can think of, so…
…thank you. Sincerely.
In the other thread after your last post, I didn’t complain at all about Tabletop. Frankly, I agree that it’s not really about getting the rules 100% right. But the way in which you, Wil, responded was terrible. That apology was not about taking responsibility, it was about making sure everyone knew that whatever went wrong, it wasn’t your fault.
It was without class and childish. I won’t support you or your products in the future because of your response, not because of anything that happened this season on TT. This is what I said in the last thread, apparently that was enough to get me banned.
I hope you see this before it gets banned, you really need a reality check. Drop the martyr complex.
Tone is sometimes hard to convey, especially in written form with none of the usual cue’s of intonation and expression we expect face to face.
And it’s made harder by the fact that when we write something we know the tone we are aiming for, and often don’t know how it will be ready by someone who doesn’t already know what the tone is supposed to be.
I bring this up, because there is nothing at all content wise about Will’s statement and apology that needs excusing.
There is nothing wrong with explaining why something went wrong, and sometimes the reason will be someone screwed up.
He accepted and stated that it was his responsibility to make sure that other people didn’t screw up, or that measures were in place to catch and fix such mistakes, and stated that he will ensure that they are in the future. And was sorry that they were not in the past.
A good apology says “We/I screwed up and takes responsibility for that, how and/or why the mistakes happened, and commits to making sure that they wont happen again.” All of that was present and correct.
Perhaps the tone wasn’t quite on point however.
That’s a mistake, but an eminently forgiveable one, certainly given the follow-up apology.
Given the level of seriousness of the situation [really not very serious] and the time and dedication that goes into making such high production quality shows as Tabletop, I disrespectfully suggest that it is your reaction that is both childish, without class, and out of touch with reality.
I am not a gamer. I remember my husband and two boys playing D&D when they were in intermediate and high school. They are still gamers. I really, really enjoy watching Tabletop and though I’m not a gamer look forward to Titans Grave every week. I am a fan of YOU and that’s why I decided to donate towards this season. The previous post was disappointing and I had to remind myself that even with your laws you’re still human and everyone can be a dick now and then, even me, my boys, and my awesome husband.Today shows me why I am a fan of YOU. EVERYTHING AWESOME THAT HAPPENS TO YOU IS DESERVED. Glad you had a wonderful Fathers Day with your sons.
I was one of the ones soured by your first response. I still love the show, for sure. But it was nice to see you say that you could’ve handled it better.
Wil,
Our family (8 year old girl and 6 year old boy) love Tabletop and now Titan’s Grave. Watching the show together leads to quality time playing new games, talking strategy, and creating memories. We appreciate you, the guests, and the team behind the scenes that make the show happen.
Thank you for bringing the gift of gaming to us. We’ll be forever grateful, no matter the number of seasons.
Thanks again,
Team Rogers (Glen, Corey, Rory, & Howard)
For what it’s worth, I felt your explanation last post was perfectly clear and reasonable, and every Tabletop I’ve watched, including this season, was interesting, entertaining, and showcased the games very well. You all getting every rule exactly right every moment is not ESSENTIAL to that formula at all.
By all means fix the situation with the person who’s supposed to keep you guys within the rules, but know that it does NOT ruin the show when it’s not perfect.
Wil,
I have felt this season is as strong as season 2, but it’s still been something that makes me sad on the odd weeks when there isn’t an episode. Not at a single point during this have I thought you were anything but one of the most avid gamers, your love for the hobby shows.
Even this season I’ve still expanded my game closet as a result. I really really want libertalia, five tribes, dead of winter, and sheriff of nottingham, and I bought stone age immediately. That episode was hilarious.
I would certainly pitch in to a season 4 on kick starter.
Really wish Oklahoma would have a game con worthy of your attention (or anyone’s) becuase I’d sure enjoy trying to play one wIth ya.
Best of luck restaffing.
God, I still muck up the rules playing Monopoly. And we’re all human, even the detractors who seem to forget that they, too, make mistakes. So you didn’t express your feelings in a way that you feel good about, I think we can all relate with similar experience. You don’t deserve to be crucified for that, and personally I don’t feel that your posts on your own site need the approval of the masses.
It sounds like you identified a key issue here: complacency set in and you became less vigilant with rules familiarity. That’s an addressable problem, whether it requires a less frantic shooting schedule or more prep time for each game. I have no doubts that you can tackle that issue and straighten it out for season four (which you should definitely make). Don’t let the negativity get to you. Take the feedback that helps you to grow, leave the rest, and play more games!